Father of Statutorially Raped Teen Mom
 

:confused: I need to hear from other parents, especially if you have been in this situation, but anybody feel free to weigh in if you want.

My sixteen year old daughter, who has been living with her mother since a divorce 11 years ago, informed me last year that she was pregnant. My grandchild was born 10 months ago, a beautiful boy. I accepted the pregnancy and child, but asked some questions and found out the dad was 20, and she had just turned 16 at the time. In our state, that is a felony. So against my daughter's loud protests, as her father, and her legal guardian, I pressed charges. He pleaded guilty and was put on probation. He is not allowed to contact her.

From that moment, my daughter, who has always been a handful, became highly hate filled towards me, accusing me of making the guy a felon, purposely going the extra mile not to listen to me on anything. Her mother is a softie, so over the years I have had to be the one to set limits and enforce them, making me the bad guy. A limit I have is not to let her cuss me out, which she has done since the shit hit the fan, so I have to make a stand. It's ugly.

As her legal guardian, I need for him to take a paternity test and pay child support if he is the dad. My daughter will have none of this and told me to fuck off, not stick my nose in her business.

My daughter requested a court hearing to ask if the guy could begin seeing her and the baby. At the same time, I gave her one month to have him get a paternity test (I know they had been talking). The month passed, so I called his probation officer who informed me of the hearing my daughter requested. So I told my daughter I would show up at the hearing and fight her request and ask for a paternity test and child support. She said if I did, that would be the end of my relationship with her and my grandson. But I had to do what was right (in my mind). We went to court and not side by side. She made her request and I made mine. I got what I wanted, and he still may not see her or the child, and must get tested.

Until he steps up like a man, and gets tested and supports the child if it is his, I see no reason why this man who victimized my child and entire family should be allowed these rights. But my daughter, not unlike many victims of this crime, doesn't see herself as a victim of a felony. All her rage is focused upon me.

I bought a car for her 5 months ago when she graduated high school, and have been holding it until she turns 18 in January and can get a license. Even though she really needs it she told me sell the car, she doesn't want it.

As her father and legal guardian, I feel the need to fight for her rights and those of my grandson, at least till she turns 18 even if she does not understand, and even if I must lose contact with her. She was 16 when this crime was committed against her, and now is 17 1/2.

Have I done what I should have? Or am I off base? What must I do? I do love her, and am willing to keep a relationship with her (if she stops cussing at me). I feel really alone. I asked her if I could see my grandson on Sundays for 2 hours and her reply was "stop harassing me, go to family court if you want visitation".

I am not a parent, but I grew up resenting my father because he left my mom, sister and I when I was very young, so I know how difficult it can be to get over deep resentments to a parent. It happened when I was about 4 or 5; I am now 34 and still don't have a great releationship with him.

I hope you don't take what I say here to badly. It's just my opinion.

You are obviously very angry, but I'm not sure if you are angry at her, yourself or the guy that did it to her. You seem to be very hung up on the idea that this guy victimzed your daughter. I would bet that she was a willing participant in the event. Sure it is a felony to have sex with a 15 year old, but I don't really see that as a crime on the same level as rape. Even calling it Statutory Rape has deep connotations that I don't really think belong here. Sex with a minor definately, but that's a whole differnt thing.

She is also very upset with you at the moment. She obviously wants this man in her life, and unless the guy is a total bum, the baby certainly deserves to have a relationship with his father.

I would say that a compromise would be in order. I know the lines of communication have been destroyed between you two, so this is the hard part. You are going to have to back down on your position if you want her to back down on hers. You drew first blood, so it's has to be you that extends the offer first. I would suggest letting the guy see the baby in exchange for the test/child support (perhaps that is already in the work because of the most recent court ruling). How long is he on probation for? Once it is over, can he see them once the probation ends?

The bottom line is that unless you do something to fix this problem your daughter will leave the house in six months, take the kid, and it may be a very long time before you see either of them again. Granted, I don't know anything about her financial situation, so this may not even be a possiblity, but I'm sure she is trying to figure it out. At this point, all you are doing is breeding resentment and that can be a very difficult thing to overcome.

Understanding is the key in situations like this. You must try to understand what she is going through. As much as you feel like she has screwed up her life... it is still her life.

I wish you the best of luck. You have a hard road ahead, and I sincerely hope that you may find a way to put your family back together.

I don't know what to say, other than that the child is growing up without a father. It seems like the man would like to have a part in the childs life. But he can't, because of your actions.

You've got a long way to repair the damage done to the relationship with your daughter. I'm not sure how to go about it. Maybe you should have a meeting with your ex-wife and discuss the situation.

This is going to sound harsh, and I'm sorry about that. It might be just how you wrote the above-quoted passage, and you could clarify it further.

So, you divorced when your daughter was 5, and the way you phrased "informed me" sounds like you haven't really been involved in her life in those intervening years. She hadn't had a father figure, and instead latched onto this guy.

Now, you suddenly get involved in a big way, but not a good way; you are doing everything to remove this guy from her life, who is her emotional center right now. Of course she will hate you for that. I know nothing of your daugher or her boyfriend, perhaps he is a heel, but it is also possible that there could be real love there.

If this isn't accurate, please correct me.

wow, seems like quite the house of cards. I can definitely understand your rage about what has happened. you cannot change what has happened, but you can do your best to make it better for the child. a few times in your post you said "if" he is the father. Now what are you saying about your daughter? Do you think she was sleeping with many guys? There seems to be some underlying anger with your daughter. Is this guy some total loser? What do you really know about him? I realize that age difference could be hard to get over, but what's done is done. time to make the best of it. Unless this guy is just some street thug, then I might suggest that you give him/them a chance. Remember, she's almost 18, after then , she will do what she wants to do.

I feel your pain, I have 3 daughters 20, 18, 15. Now for the harsh part, statisticly you know that girls who do not have a strong father figure in the house are attracted to older boys/men and are far more likely to have sex with them shortly after puberty. I am not sure what role you played in her life in the past 10 years but it sounds as though it was minimal (correct me if I am wrong) so you have must take some blame here. That said it time to stop parenting and start guiding. You need to make a decision whether you want a relationship with your daughter/grandson and boyfriend or not.

If so - suck it up and apologize to your daughter for not being there for her and accept some blame. Take the boyfriend out to a ballgame without your daughter, find out what he is about and what his intentions are. Treat them as you would neighbors asking you for you opinion on things. No more controlling. (this will not be easy to do)

If not - wash your hands of this and accept the fact that soon she will be 18 and there is a good chance you will have little contact with this family as they move forward in their lives.

not sure what to say, i do send my hopes and prayers with your family and hope you can make it through this tough time.

Thank you all for your replies. I am listening, and I am striving for understanding.

Dane, I think that the guy might be a total bum, but I'm not sure. He's 22 now, and came to court in a white undershirt almost down to his knees. He speaks no English, has no education, and barely making minimum wage. He lives with his mom, who has no knowledge about any of this. It has always been my position that he should have a big part in the baby's life, but ONLY AFTER he has stepped up like a man and accepted paternity and set up regular child support payments, even if they are just token at this time. My daughter is completely against this for some reason.

Averett- the man is more than welcome, from my perspective, to have a part in the child's life IF he has stepped up like a man...etc..etc. see above paragraph. He can't have a relationship now because of MY actions? I'm not the one who committed a felony against a child, and her family. He is in trouble because of his own actions. I am just making sure that the law as it is on the books, is being applied.

Redlemon - Yes, my ex has custody of my daughter and has throughout our divorce. I have always paid child support fully and on time, had the kids over for the weekends, followed through on their health care issues, and tried to participate in the important moments of their lives. But I know that I have missed out on a lot of her development. I know that about three years ago my daughter started hanging out and emulating gang individuals, which is when I had to turn up the attention, and boundry setting with her. And again, I'm not trying to remove him from her life, but to just have him accept paternity and support the child like a true man would do.

98MustGT- Yes I found those statistics (too late), and of course I want a relationship with them, I can suck it up, and accept a large portion of the blame as to why she is the way that she is, but as of yet, I still want him to accept paternity and make support payments. All my efforts (besides the initial prosecution) are towards those ends only. As for now, there is no chance of the ballgame, or even a civil communication with my daughter. If I called, she would hang up on me. And I don't know how I am going to see my grandson, short of going to get visitation rights in family court.

Thank you all for your input. I can take it, even if it is harsh. I am trying to understand. But doesn't anyone see it my way? Any dads out ther in similar situation? Keep the replies coming and God bless.

You keep insisting that he not be granted access to the baby until he takes a paternity test, but from my understanding of what I've read here, he's not challenging the paternity. He seems to have acknowledged that he's the father, so why do you keep insisting on the test? Ditto for child support. You haven't said anywhere that he won't pay it. Maybe he and your daughter had an arrangement/plan in that regard that you obstructed when you started taking legal action.

I'm sorry to say that but...
it's no wonder your daughter hates you. Your daughter obviously has a thing for this guy, and you step into her way and make everything bad for her. I'm not a father myself, but I'm pretty sure there's this fatherly thing that doesn't want their little girl to grow up. Let me pose to you this question: if you were in your daughters situation, what would you do? Would you sit back and say "oh please press charges against the man I love dad, please stop him from seeing his child". No I don't think you would. You are being too much of a hard ass on her.

I too understand why your daughter is upset. However her behavior shows me that she is still very much a child and needs you to set strong boundaries for her. Would I have done the same thing in your situation? If the guy is a negative influence in her life, ABSOLUTELY. Now having said that, I would suggest sitting down with your daughter and having a rational conversation with her. Let her know that as a father it is your responsibility to look out for her, and as a grandfather you will always look out for this baby. Do this not as an authority figure, but with love and patience. If you wish to continue the relationship w/ your daughter and grandchild, you may have to make some concessions, and let her make her mistakes, however I don't think it is unreasonable for you to ask that she at least meets you halfway.

Touchy issue. Hope this doesn't sound to bad but...
Point 1. If he is saying it is his, then the hell with the test. He admits it, and if his name is on the birth certificate, that is leagly binding UNLESS a test proves other wise. So, if he put his name down as the dad, he HAS stepped up to the plate, and you need to rethingk your stance here. If he wants to be a father to this child, then good for him. It is more then many want to do.

Point 2. From what I am reading, while you try to be a part of your daughters life, you are not the main focus of it. That means that from her view, you are there to lend support, not disapline. Yes, you are her father, and you should do whatever you can to help her, even if it is not what she wants at the time, but, Would you want someone you only see on the weekends to tell you how to run your life? Not an attack on you my friend, just wanting you to see what may be her veiw. This hard line stance you are take, given the realationship as I perseive it from these words ona web page, is probably not the best way to go if you want her to think happy thoughts of you later in life.

Point 3. You insistance on your daughter being avictom her may not be right. Kids grasp this world at a frighteningly young age these days, and while in someways they still are kids, they are also a lot more grown up then the older generations were at there age. If I was a father, I would shot the son of a bitch that touched my little girl, but at the same time, i would also have to face that it was something SHE desided to do as well. Unless it was flat out rape, and then niothing could save the fucker from my wrath. But, don't view her as a victim here. Treat her like a thinking adult. I'm sure that is all she really wants, and your hard line stance is a slap in the face to her veiw of herself as a free minded person.

Sit down and talk to her, like an adult, and let her know how you you worry and fear for her, and how much you love her. Don't come off angry, or talk down to her. You will lose her in a flash if you do. find out what she wants, and find a way that you can both live with this situation and each other. What you think of this man, in the lopng term, has no relivence to the situation. Once she is 18, if she wants to be with him, she will, and you can do nothing about it. Don't lose a child here man, gain a family.

i'm gonna dissent from the majority here (try to contain your shock everyone) and say that you not only didn't go too far, you're not going far enough.

She's living in a fantasy world that she can have this kid and not have to hold him responsible for it because mommy and daddy are paying for it. She needs to learn that there are consequences to being stupid (and having sex at 16 is the epitome of stupid) and that if she doesn't want to step up to the plate and do what needs to be done (get child support) then she will have to bear those consequences. Namely, cut her the hell off for a while - it won't take long before she realizes that money is a necessary component to child rearing. Make her aware that until she's willing to hold her rapist (and I don't have a problem with statutory rape, btw. We're talking about adults having sex with children. That is unequivocably wrong) responsible for what he did, she won't get monetary support from you either.

She wants to have her cake and eat it too - have the baby fully funded without upsetting this guy that she thinks she loves. Unfortunately, that's not how the real world works, and the sooner she learns that the sooner she can start working toward being a responsible adult rather than a spoiled child.

*dons flameproof suit*

Thanks for replies, they help me by giving me a wider set of viewpoints to consider than just my own. It appears that overwhelmingly you all think I screwed up.

DJ Happy, Seer666 - He has never officially accepted paternity. On the birth certificate, the space for father is blank. The only arrangement he has with my daughter for supporting the child is 'she doesn't ask and he doesn't pay'. But some day in the future the baby will start eating her out of house and home, and the father will be making more money, and if my daughter signs away her rights to support like she wants to do (out of some misguided loyalty, Stockholm Effect, love, or the subtle effects of adult-over-child coersion) it will be a big mistake. And I'm not going to let that happen while she is still on my watch.

Slimshadee - I am not the one who made things bad for my daughter. She was the one who made the choice to hang with the wrong people, she was the one who allowed herself to get too close to adults who did not have her best interests in mind, but wanted to use her for their own pleasure. She made things bad for herself, but as a child, was not fully responsible for her behavior, but the adults were, and I feel it is my responsibility, as her father, to hold them accountable.

cj2112 - As for now, sitting down with her would be out of the question. She will not do it. If I were to call, she would hang up and tell me to stop harassing her. So I think that letting some time go by is the only option for now. But I can use this time to try go gain a fuller understanding of the situation, rather than to just see it from my own personal perspective.

Shakran - Actually, she and the baby are living off the child support I am still sending her mom for her, which will cut off in December after 12 years. She also collects welfare, which I call charity. There are many programs available for teen moms who want to go to college (she's attending the local community college. for now). Actually, my assertive approach to this is edging her on to succeed in college, since she will go to any length to prove that I am full of shit, even getting good grades! (she nearlyt failed out of high school before she was pregnant by cutting class, not doing work, etc.---at the pregnant girls school she did better, because she didn't have to be there at a particular time, she picked up her work and did it at home, in order to graduate).

Thank you all for your responses. Please keep them coming.

I cannot input much here as this would be a difficult situation for anyone to deal with, but you keep stating this above as if your daughter was forced into having intercourse with this youg man, which from the sounds of things was not at all the case, but instead a willing event between two paricipants. Maybe to sit back and re-think the whole pressing of the charges for that and MAYBE, MAYBE I say you will have a little more success in getting your daughter to understand what is going on and why you are trying to get him to pay up for the kid if it in fact is his.

From what I am reading you seem to be more upset by this guy being a "loser" if you will by your description of him in the court case scenario above....white undershirt to his knees speaks no english etc. You are upset with a guy who got your daughter pregnant and may not be willing to help support what he helped create, but I think you saw a way to get more "even" by using the whole age thing as well, when all you wanted was your daughter and this guy to be responsible for their actions.

If any of this is unclear or rambling I aplogize like I said above it is hard for me to relate just respond to what I get from the one sided story above, not to mention I am only 28 and have no kids of my own (unless you count my 2 dogs ) :/

The picture does get a little clearer, Victor.

You characterize this guy as a bum and say that your daughter has run around with the wrong crowd (gang types). I now have a better perspective on this, and I can even see why you did what you did. There is not much worse IMO than someone not taking responsibility for their actions. Unfortunately, getting him convicted of SR hasn't forced him to take responsibility, and all it has done is drive a wedge between you and your daughter.

This may sound like a flip flop, but I belive you have the justification for your actions. Not because he victimized your daughter, but because he is not being the man/father that he should (assuming he is the father). Living up to responsiblity is a measure of a person. He has obviously not done that.

Being justified in your actions, does not solve your problem, however. This is really the issue at heart. She is young and doesn't totally understand life yet. What it means to be a single mother with no money/insurance, etc. I understand this is why you have done what you have done. You are being a good parent... but again, that is now what's at issue here. You now have to come to a very hard decision. Either you cave on your position and work things out somehow, or you stick to your guns and your daughter probably walks out of your life.

Perhaps letting her have a go at it on her own is not such a bad idea. She may realize that you were right all along. Just let her go in such a way that she knows that she can always come back. Make sure she realizes that you love her and just want what's best for her and her child. Then give her space and see what happens.

Once again you act like the guy flat out held her against her will and forcefully raped her. Do you ever think that she wanted to participate in the act or not. It may be statutory rape, but this is one area of the law I think needs to be updated. I see nothing wrong with a 20 year old having sex with a 16 year old, so long as the 16 year old is completely of sound mind and a willing participant. 16 year olds are ALOT more mature than they were in your generation. I'm 20 myself, and I'm sure that there are 16 year old girls a hell of alot more mature than me who can handle what comes to them (and no I wouldn't have sex with a 16 year old btw, because 18 year olds are hotter :p). Did you ever stop to think that she wants her baby to have a daddy in her life, because you were never there for her when she was a kid? Give the guy a chance to show that he can be a good father to your grandchild. It sure as hell will help the kid growing up.

I'm not necessarily against the idea of underage sex, but having a child at only 16 is stupid beyond any reason. She proved through that act alone she is not mature. Underage pregnancy is never a good idea. She needs the guidance of someone more rational than herself, like her father.
If your description is accurate, the guy does seem like your average loser. Nail him to the wall whether your daughter likes it or not. Sometimes you have to be tough to be kind. He needs to pay money towards his child, which it does not sound like he will do willingly. Maybe you should have a talk with the guy and let him know where his responsibilities lie.
Whatever you decide to do, don't let this alone. Don't let your daughter's child suffer because of her foolish choices.

A couple things to say here:

First, I don't disagree with your actions really. Perhaps you could have gotten across the importance of them to your daughter better, but I get the impression that you tried and she's simply to young and naive to understand.

A lot of comments have pointed out that he did not forcably have sex with her. This is true. However, the reason we have statutory rape laws is because when there is an age difference such as this one, it is easy to coerce the child - and that's what she is - into sex. She thinks she's in love; he's enjoying a good "lay."

The fact is, ignoring the nice "moral" reasons for trying to do what you're trying to do, I'm going to look at it from a "selfish" perspective. Right now, YOU are funding her and her child's life. It sounds to me - especially given that she's on welfare and hanging out with gangbangers - that her mom is pretty much a deadbeat too. If you don't mind my asking, why don't you have custody, and why didn't you fight to get custody once it became clear her mother was not providing any authority? Either way, with a deadbeat mom and the guy not paying child support - and her not WANTING him to - YOU are the one funding her and this child. Even if you get him to pay child support, she will simply return it to him. However, the good side of it is that when she finally realizes she needs it, she may start to keep it.

And now for the "harsh" part: I think she's a lost cause. By this time in her life, I don't think there's much you can do to help her see the "error of her ways" so to speak. Make sure she knows you'll always be ready and there if and when she decides she would like to speak with you again, but when she turns 18, *DO NOT GIVE HER ANYTHING.* Yes, it's hard considering it's your grandchild, but if you continue to support her out of guilt or love or whatever after she is 18, YOU will end up being the financial father to this child - and whether or not you get this guy to pay child support won't matter because, like I said, she'll just return it or find some way to not use it. Not only will you be their financial support now, but you will be for a significant time to come. And it will only perpetuate her own irresponsibility, because whenever you decide to stop, there will always be welfare available as well. At this point, I would do what's best for YOU financially, while trying to secure the future of your daughter and grandchild. Make sure that she has child support to lean on once she's 26, living on the streets and off welfare and hasn't talked to this guy in 6 years, but don't give her ANY money until she starts acting more like an adult and more like the parent that she now is (if that ever happens which I don't think it will). Hopefuly, when she's working in McDonald's in her mid-20's she'll realize that she can lead a better life and perhaps reinitiate a relationship with you. Once she realizes she has more worth, then help her all you want.

Like others, I tend to think you are heading in the right direction but took a path filled with brambles. I'm certain it was not an easy decision (if I'm mistaken and it was then that should tell you it wasn't the right one) and I have little doubt that a large part of your actions was looking out for your daughter and grandchild.

But, from your writing it seems that you have taken the act that resulted in your grandchild as an affront to your family and yourself. You portray it as a crime against your whole family.

This was certainly a crime and your daughter is, in a way, a victim but she is not nearly the victim that the law treats her as. I hope that you see this too. She's guilty of making bad decisions and the man in her life is guilty of slightly more than that since he had to know what he was doing was illegal. But they are both really just kids. It's possible that this man could mature and be a stand up guy. It may not happen in the time frame that you would like but no court is going to force him to mature. This man will hopefully be in this child's life for the next several decades. The actions you've already taken and those you take in the very near future will color the relationship you have with him, your daughter, and your grandchild. Beyond that your attitude and actions will shape the relationship your grandchild has with your daughter and its father.

Your daughter seems to have written you off right now. What about the father? If you want him to start acting like a man perhaps it's time you treated him as one (whether he's proven that he deserves it or not). Talk to him and explain the things you've outlined in this thread. He probably understands a lot of your concerns and he probably shares a lot of them. He may just surprise you. You can't dictate the pace of him taking responsibility but you may be able to remove some of the barriers to it.

And please, do not use the support you provide to her as a lever. You want what's best for your daughter and grandchild. I hope that you would consider continuing the support so long as it's being used responsibly by her to care for herself and the child.

Good luck.

You should have considered the consequences before you pressed charges. The young man will have a hard time getting a job and a residency if he was indeed charged and convicted (Prob now a sex offender) Your daughter having sex with a older man was consensual (only a couple of months make it legal or not) and was old enough to make a decision to have sex and now she has to deal with the consequences of not having her babies father in her life, because of you. What the young man did was stupid, they dont call it jail bait for a reason. The bottom line is that he will almost never find appropriate work, will have a hard time finding a place to stay (society doesnt rent to those convicted of sex crimes) and your grandchild will grow up, maybe knowing you or probably not. Your daughter was not a victim of a crime but a voluntary partner in a consensual act (older or not) and she is aware of that. She is also aware that you took someone from her against her will (which should be a crime) Preventing, for the time being of the father to be there and starting a cycle of life that is probably going to be repeated. Im not saying you should be ashamed of your actions, but you sow what you reap.

* a note to add, although it is commonly reffered to as statutory rape. In most states the term statutory rape does not exist. The young man was probably charged with unlawful sex with a minor or lude and lascivious. Statutory rape is a term thrown about becaue people watch to much tv, and it sounds better that lude and lascivious acts with a minor.

Once again being charged with a sex crime *statisticley prohibits any young adult from leading a productive lives. They are lumped together with child molestors, and real rapists.

88 percent of girls under the age of 16 who become pregnant the father is 5-8 years older. Only about 8 percent of those cases are tried in court, and that is only the number reported because the girls become pregnant.

Thank you all for your responses.

xxdrewshadexx

I appreciate your comments, as I am trying to explore all sides of this issue. To clarify, He is on probation for three years, no jail time, and if he keeps out of trouble (I don't think he will be doing this to any more young girls), it will be reduced to a misdemeanor, and possible deleted from his record all together eventually. He is not considered a sex offender. According to the law and to my opinion, a girl, who had just turned 16, (not a couple of months to make it legal, 1.8 years actually in my daughter's case), does not have the ability, self-knowledge, and/or emotional maturity to consent to sex. I did not prevent him from seeing my daughter and the child, the law did. His voluntary actions in disregarding the law, brought about the consequence of no contact, at least until his probation is modified. And as of how my opinion is right now, I will continue to fight modification until he gets tested and my grandson has a father's name on his birth certificate, and child support is happening. Then I am all for him being a dad to the baby. I don't see that as being unreasonable. And it's a good thing that I did press charges; otherwise I would have no leverage over him to ensure he does the responsible thing for the baby.

I guess, as a parent, when someone harms your child or commits a crime against them, the instinct is to circle up the wagons, and fight to protect them. Irregardless of the reasons (which I see as her lack of understanding of adult responsibilities) I can see that this situation is also harming my daughter, perhaps more than the original crime. :(

Update: This weekend, for the first time in 10 months, my 17 year old daughter refused to let me visit the baby, even though I have been visiting him regularly up till now, and my child support is paying for the roof over his (and her) head, and my medical benefits provided for his birth and neonatal care. So, I made an appointment to see a lawyer, as I will probably have to go to Family Court to invoke my grandparent visitation rights. What a pity. She said that since it is my fault that the dad can't see the baby, then I can't either. That's an opinion that several of the posters share, but I don't as of yet see it that way. Thank you all for your opinions, and please keep 'em coming.

That sentence bears repeating. You hit the nail on the head.

To those of you who think 16 year olds are more mature now than they used to be, that's bullshit. They know more about sex. They think more about sex. They have more sex. But that does NOT make them more mature.

I can drive a ferarri, but that doesn't make me a race car driver.

The fact that some kids are having sex at 16 does not make them mature.

I've had a little shift in my perspective, and am feeling a little hopeful.

I've been thinking about...what is God's will in all of this?

I don't think it is about tearing my family apart, even if I am right. I can be right and still my family will be destroyed. The father's job is to preserve and protect the family.

I think that any more "tough love" on my part will just further escalate the situation and make it all the more difficult than ever to resolve. I think I've done enough.

It's time to mellow out my anger and resentment against this guy. Those emotions will only cause me and everyone else more trouble. This situation has really hurt me, and each of my family in a different way. That was his crime. I think everyone has felt enough pain. He's going to be tested. He will eventually be hooked into child support, and he is doing his probation time. I think he probably has learned his lesson. I think (hope) my daughter has had a wake up call, as have I, regarding my own strategy in this crisis. It's possible to be 100% right and dead wrong.

I'm not sure what actions to take from this point on, and how to go about the rebuilding. I think it is time to let my daughter make her own decisions, and just try to be there for when she falls, to give her a shoulder to boost up with (without being an enabler). It may take a long time before there is even any contact, but I think that I'm through with courts etc. Someone said that I need to be the first one to compromise. I guess it's time to just be a spectator. Perhaps, at some point not too distant, she will have a spurt of growth and compromise a bit and let me see my grandson.

I think in a couple of days, I'll write her a letter, telling her of this and reminding her of my eternal love, and letting her know that my path was my best efforts at trying to help her, and asking forgiveness and understanding for any mistakes I might have made in the process.

I should probably just have written this in my journal, but you all have been so helpful, I thought that I need to put it here. Feel free to chime in.

Sounds like she's far too immature to run her own life.

But as long as she wants to act like an adult, she should live like an adult. I see no reason for you to continue paying support and contributing medical, other than your own generosity.

Maybe when she can't aford to eat she will see how bad of a desicion it was.

well, if he's going to take the test and get legally locked into child support, I agree with your assessment. That's what's necessary to protect her from her own misguidedness and it seems as though it's taken care of now.

The only way to really know if you screwed up or not is to wait a really long time and see fi your daughter is still resentful or if she turns around and thanks you. Anything else is subjective, so I'll just throw out my opinion and let you decide whether I'm a wise fool or a rambling idiot.

If you want my opinion, pressing charges against the father of the child was the wrong thing to do. From the way your initial post was written, it sounds like you had little contact with your daughter until you heard about the kid. It is said that actions speak louder than words, and what you did came across to your daughter as putting a bullhorn to her ear and screaming "YOU FUCKED UP AND I'LL NEVER LET YOU FORGET IT." You maintain that this guy harmed your child, when she obviously doesn't think so.

On to the next point. People can debate until they're blue in the face about when someone is responsible enough to have sex, but it's really an individual thing that shouldn't be generalized. My feelings on the subject are that sex should be openly discussed and any questions answered from an early age, and that doing so should enable a young adult to understand what is involved and make a decision for himself or herself. Later on in the thread, you used the phrase "What is God's will," which inidcates to me that 1: sexuality probably wasn't an open topic for discussion between you and your daughter, and 2: you probably disagree with what I said anyway.

The last issue I want to address is your repetition of the assertion that he needs to "step up like a man." This suggests a few things. First, you're approaching this from a very traditional standpoint, in which the father should provide for the family and the mother should raise the kids. Second, it indicates a macho attitude was engrained in your mind as a child, and that your father did his best to hammer this mantra into your mind and raise you to be a very traditional person. Through all of this, you are divorced from your wife, she has had custody of your child, and she hasn't raised the child as you would have. You can see from what I said above that I'm assuming you were raised in a traditional family, and assuming this, the fact that your family did not follow that model is emotionally traumatic to you. To combat this and "set things right," you have fully supported your children financially, seen them at every possible time, and tired to be there at every important time in their lives. The problem with this is that you still feel obliged to keep that traditional family structure, and being divorced does not allow you to do that. In order to fulfill your obligation, you are now trying to force your daughter to adopt that structure. This is why you were able to handle the news of the pregnancy, but freaked out and reacted so strongly when they weren't adhereing to your mental blueprint.

The only way to resolve the issue is to compromise. Unfortunately for you, your daughter will not be the one to do it. There are a few ways to look at what is the right thing to do. In this situation, it looks like the motive of your action was good, but the results didn't turn out to be good. If a good motivation doesn't work, the only other thing left to do is to take action motivated solely by the result. Go against the inner voice that tells you that you did the right thing and should stick by it, it's not going to patch up your relationship with your daughter.

Right now, you need to do what will give you the best results. Step up, be a big man, and admit that you might have reacted too strongly. If you do, you'll have the opportunity to see your grandson come running through the door, smiling, and rushing to give you a big hug when they visit you. If not, you'll be lucky if you see them at all.

My opinion:

I don’t know the specifics about your daughter’s situation, but if she's still that pissed at you, she's going to leave the house when she's 18 and you won't see her or the baby again for a long time. Your daughter was a willing participant in the creation of this child, so I have a hard time accepting the rape thing. Yes, technically it's a crime to have sex with a minor but that law was written by people who think that sex is a dirty thing that should be swept under the rug. I don't really believe that it's effective at all. I think that you're just mad because somebody "violated" your child and you're pissed about it. You want to get even. And in the course of your getting even you've destroyed the lines of communication with your daughter. Like I wais, she was a willing participant so I have a hard time believing that it was rape. Even if she was 16. I think that law is bullshit but at the same time it's not good if 20 years olds are fucking 14 year olds either. I think that every situation should be viewed differently. Bottom line, you're going to have to give a little if you want to see your grandchild.

This is entirely true, and if someone is getting pregnant at 16 they're clearly not responsible enough to be having sex. Unfortunately, this is obviously too late to recognize the problem.

Hey uh... hasn't she lived with her mother for 11 of her 16 years on this planet?

I really don't want to be rude, but I have to tell you the first thing that came to my mind, as a bastard child, was:

"Oh, now you want to chime in. Well fuck you buddy."

You're not really a "father", you're more of a sperm donor and a check-writer.

I also don't think it's very manly of you to use some puritanical American laws to seriously damage some guys family & future, because he was born too soon.

My girlfriend is 4 yrs younger than I am and we've been together for 6 years, I'm 25, you do the math, I guess I'm REALLY lucky her dad isn't such a prick.

BTW, and this is just opinion, but isn't a father sticking his nose so far into his daughter's bedroom life, a little.... perverted, creepy, gross?

Not to mention your stubborness isn't gonna change anything for the positive. It will however multiply any negative feelings toward you. Consequently, fucking you out of the joy of being a grandparent.

Is your point of view THAT important?

Ok, I understand that you have had a change of heart, but there are a few things I would like to say, that I didn't notice mentioned elsewhere.

First off, you have openly admitted that you had knowledge of her hanging with certain 'gang' crowds, and being with people you'd rather not see her with. Well, I have to sit back and ask, Where were you then? I don't hear you saying that you did anything to keep her away from them...Restraining orders...yadda yadda. Yes, they are hard to come by without a reason behind them, I know that. But it doesn't keep you from turning her away from them to get her into something better. Take time out of your life and treat her out to dinner instead of letting her hang on the streets with her new 'friends'. It is possible you know, that you could have cut this off before it even got started by being there for her and talking to her about the results of her actions, any of which she could have been making at this time, and all of which could have turned out differently. I have to admit that hearing you say you didn't do anything until 10 months after the baby was born, and only after she opened up to you with the truth and shared her life with you, did you finally see you needed to do something. A little late don't you think?? The baby can't go back, the sex act can't be removed from her memory and your little daughter isn't goint to act like a child but like a Mother, because like it or not, 17 or not, your daughter or not, she is a MOM now and has more on her mind then you think she might. The time for intervention passed you by a long time ago.

Can you prove this guy hasn't given her any money? Can you prove this guy and your daughter didn't have something that was in the process of flourishing? Did you take into consideration that your daughter has watched her Mother raise her 'on her own' (yes we know you send child support and pay all their bills, but she lives with her Mom, that fact stares her right in the face everyday...not a check that does in the bank that she probibly doesn't see physically)? Maybe she wants to do this on her own, and doesn't want any kind of ties with the guy? Maybe if the guy is forced to pay child support, then your daughter will be forced to give him visitation and she doesn't want to deal with that?? Maybe this guy has 'gang' friends who will take his being arrested a little to far and hold it against her or her child?? Yes, some of these things are a bit over annalized, but to a young mother whom you have stated yourself is still thinking like a child, they can stand out hugely and fog any reasonable thought.

Now that that is out, I also want to say that what you did was honorable in a sense, as you were just trying to help your daughter, more then some would be willing to do. But before you do something like this, you really should take your daughter's feelings into consideration. Think about everything that has happened, and really think, then look at yourself in the mirror and say it was worth it....was it?

The other problem is this, if they did have a thing, do you really think that he is going to want to get caught up in a family battle and give his all to his son, to have grandpa try and come up with some new scheme to screw things up? Even if you never intend to intervene again, he has to worry about saying/doing the wrong thing and land himself in jail with more charges that he can't explain. He pleaded guilty, admitted to having sex with your daughter...that to me says he's 'manning up' to his actions. No it doesn't put his name on the birth certificate, but it shows he knows what he did, and obviously understands the results of those actions.

Plain and simple, my opinion isn't going to change what has happened or what will happen, but I felt the need to say a few things since you asked it of anyone willing to share. I hope that you and your family are well and that everything works out in the end. I also hope you do write that letter, because I think it's a great idea, and it will allow your daughter to read it at her own pace instead of it being thrown down her throat without a second to think.

Sincerely,
Hashbrowns

I find it interesting all these assumptions that just because he's divorced he was not involved in his daughter's life before this. Maybe I missed something, but I don't think he said that. Not to mention, if that was the case, who's to say it was of his own doing?

From my point of view, damaging the guy's life has nothing to do with it. The father was refusing the legally admit paternity which would make it so that, in the future, he would not be obligated to pay child support. That doesn't strike me the least bit as someone who is 1) emotionally bound to her and 2) planning on taking responsibility for his kid.

Again, ANYONE who is not mature enough to be able to avoid getting pregnant and capable enough to handle the consequences is not mature enough or capable enough to be choosing to have sex. The very fact that she had a child at 16 is proof alone that she did not comprehend her actions in an adult manner. This is why legal ages of consent exist.

From what I've read, there were two options:
1) Let the guy avoid being recognized legally as the father thus allowing him a way out of EVER paying for the child's life. In X years, when they're no longer together (and they WON'T be, just like 99% of the cases like this - congratulations if you're one of the lucky few), he will have no legal obligation to be paying child support and victor's daughter will be living off of welfare (still) and relying on her parent's money to survive. She will have even LESS of an ability to ever get a college education (not that she has much of a chance as it is being a 16 your old mother) and she will pretty much permanently be living in lower-class status.

or 2) The father of the child is forced to be legally recognized and, thus, locked into paying child support. This helps to at least soften the issues that are already certain to arise by the simple fact she is a teen mother and clearly not making good decisions in her life hanging out with gangbangers, etc. Perhaps since the father is paying shild support she will be able to put the rest of her money towards something like a college education of some sort, allowing her to have a shot at getting a decent job with decent pay. She will hopefully not be living off welfare for a significant period of time, and she won't be relying on her parents to support her until she's 35.

I don't see where the debate is between the two. Now, the question is how one should handle the situation AFTER paternity is legally declared. In regards to that I think victor is on the right track. The security blanket is in place for his daughter, so nothing more needs to be done at this point. He's done the "parental" thing, and now is the time to mend the wounds. It'll take a lot of time and a lot of hard work, but it can be done. The fact of the matter is though, she won't understand any of this in a mature way until she's in her mid-20s or so. But, that doesn't mean to wait until then. The only way she'll ever understand that this was done for her and her child's financial protection is to SHOW her that continuously from this point on by NOT doing anything else since it has been accomplished. Continue to try and see her and her child, continue to call and write her letters, telling her how you love her and care for her and are sorry that this caused her pain etc. One can only hope that one day, after this guy does whatever he'll eventually do to end up leaving her and she's left without his moral support, but still his financial support at least, she'll realize WHY it was so important that he be legally recognized as the father.

I can most definatly see your point Secret Method, and I understand why the money is a good thing for her and the childs benefit. I understand that everyone thinks welfare isn't a way to live, but when it's all you have...it's all you have. I'd rather see her living on welfare and that child have a chance at life then no chance at all. I also believe that this should just be a 'keep me going' type of thing, not permenant. As victor already said, she's already in college, she graduated high school, and is keeping good grades.

I also never said he did anything he shouldn't have, but pointed out that there was plenty of time before this to 'nip it in the bud', not that he never spent time with her, but that he didn't spend the right time with her and prevented her from being with all these 'gang' crowds in the first place. Hind sight is 20/20.

I don't even know if these remarks were meant for me, but I can see them relating, and just had to verify that I wasn't insulting or implying anything was right or wrong, just that it could have gone many other ways and still can.

Lemme 'splain somethin' to ya.

If a 16 year old has a job, and her own place to live, and does not depend on her parents for ANYTHING at all, and her parents do not give her ANYTHING to help her survive, then she shouldn't have to listen to what they have to say.

As long as she has her hand out asking Daddeee for a check, then he has every right to require her to do what he wants her to do.

That sperm donor/check writer comment of yours screams immaturity. Sure, it'd be great from the kid's perspective if she could do anything she wanted and still get everything she wants from her parents, but that's not how the real world works.

If the kid wants to take and take and take from the parent, then the parent has the right to expect the kid to comply with the parent's wishes.

As for the puritanical american laws idea - look, I think this guy has shown remarkeable restraint. I'd throw the fear of God into any jackass who raped and knocked up my daughter. I wouldn't just be getting child support, I'd have his ass arrested and prosecuted.

Gee, maybe the idea that it's bad for men to have sex with little boys is puritanical- maybe the government should stop prosecuting NAMBLA members. Hell let's give 'em a medal! They're pointing out how repressed our society is.

Most 18 year olds are immature as hell even though they're classified as adults. If you don't believe me, go check out any college dorm and see what they're up to.

If you seriously think the average 16 year old is mature enough to make responsible decisions about having sex, then you have a disjointed sense of reality, and I frankly feel sorry for your children.

Sex isn't a big deal anymore for 16 year olds. It's not like how it was 40 years ago where sex was reserved for only marriage. Shakran, I'm guessing you are ALOT older than 16, so you wouldn't really know what a 16 year old is like today.

Hey guys! Check it out! Slimshaydee has singlehandedly written the authoritative creedo on parenting! If you're not the age of your child, you can't possibly understand what she can do or where she is in her maturity, so don't parent her at all! Let her do anything she wants! Only another 16 year old can know what's best for a 16 year old!


Wait, no, that sounds pretty stupid when you think about it, doesn't it ;)

Look I'm not approaching sex from a puritanical perspective. In fact, I'd feel comfortable wagering that no one on this board will do so. Puritanical anti-sex freaks don't tend to frequent a board on which pornography is available, ya know?

I don't really care if people have sex outside of marriage. Fine by me.

Where I start to care is when children are doing things that should be in the realm of adulthood.

Sixteen year olds are by and large not mature enough to make responsible decisions about sex. How do we know this? Look at the example right here in this situation. She had sex, got pregnant, then stuck her hand out for cash. People who are mature enough to handle sex 1) take precautions so they greatly reduce the pregnancy risk and 2) do not go running to their daddy the minute they find out they're gonna have a kid.

Look shakran, I don't believe Slimshaydee, or anybody else, is saying to let a 16 year old do whatever they want. God knows what trouble I would've gotten into at 16 if my parents'd let me. Nonetheless, I was having sex at 16 with my girlfriend, though she was the same age, and nothing bad came of it because we were both mature enough to be informed and took precautions to keep from having her get pregnant. I think it's pretty naïve to say that all, or even most, 16 year olds are too immature to have sex, though I agree with you,at least in part, about this particular case. But sex isn't something that is in the realm of adulthood anymore, if it ever was, no matter how much you think it should be. The times, they are a-changin'.

that's more what i was trying to say

We're not talking here about children having sex with children (which while it is not a good idea, I'm not unrealistic enough to believe it won't ever happen). We're talking about adults having sex with children.

People are getting on him because he's angry that a grown man had sex with his child. That's absurd. Adults have no business having sex with children. Period, end of sentence.

It's not like it was a 30 year old going at it with a 13 year old...there's only 4 years difference between the 2. Theres 60 year olds out there having sex with 18 year olds, but yet you will probably think this is alright.

I'm going to post without reading any responses, lest I respond to them and not you.

From a fellow father of a beautiful daughter that makes life worth living: A 20 year old man had unprotected sex with your (then) 16 year old daughter and she became pregnate. This is cut and dry. It's illegal and he deserved whatever punishment stipulated by law. There is no argument there. He was put on probation and was not allowed to contact her by court order. He contacted her, thus breaking that order. This tells me that this guy, whether or not he cares for your daughter, is someone who is willing to break a court order. You gave your daughter one month to get a paternity test out of the guy. Nothing. This guy is obviously not a person who is willing to try to compromise with you. I have to admire you for not beating the guy. I don't know how much self control I would be able to muster in your situation.

Now your daughter is really mad at you. In her mind you are the bad guy in this situation, not her deabeat dad boyfriend. This is to be expected. Just keep telling her that you want what is best for her and her son, because you really do. I hope to God that she can get some perspective, but when and if she does, it will take time. Keep being a good father. I feel for you and I really hope that this can get resolved.

Note: you might want to contact your ex about this. I'm sure your daughter has gone crying to her with the whole situation, so you might have an opportunity to keep in touch with her indirectly through your ex.

I look at it from a different perspective. I see nothing of how you are where you are. I only see now and believe that actions taken now can shape the future.

Tell your daughter that you love her every time you see her. Even before you have a chance to disagree on anything. Let her know that you only want the best for her.

You can pick your friends, not your family. You now have an unofficial son-in-law. You can choose to keep him at a distance (and your daughter at this time) or switch up and get to know him, mentor him and maybe mold him into a respectable father. If he is from a less than desirable family lifestyle, maybe he just needs a boost up. Show him how you live and see if he can manage to change his life focus.

At least it would not be rape, eh?

i went through the same thing with my sister, minus the part about becoming pregnent. My sister became very upset with my parents and it became very tense in the house, b/c it was my parents that made her bring charges againts the guy. I think my parents did the right thing, and things have smoothed out with my parents and sister. I find it hard to belive that at some point down the road she will understand you had her best intrests in mind and will come around. As a child, like she is right now, i am sure she does not understand the breth of the subject, and is not able to understand your forcefulness towards things like the partenity test. I belive you did the right thing.

Then I misunderstood that part, and you are right in holding him to the test. Make him face up. i was under the impression that he already had. I still feel you should have a heart to heart with the girl though, and try to empithise with her. Not give in on that part, mind you, just try and make her understand that you you are very worried about her and love her, without stepping on her beliefs that she can think for herself. Hard line, I know. And I do hope that you can resolve the conflict with her. these kind of things are very hard to deal with. As for him, take him to the goat locker and give him a wall to wall to make him do what is right if you have to.

I feel V is doing what is right.....screw the daughter and what she wants...she is the one that messed up not him. I am only 23 and a parent but I would kill if I had to to make sure my daughter is safe and taken care of. Even though he may be your grandchild you still fight for the best thing possible if your punkass daughter doesnt want it. Aslong as "you" do the right thing that is all that matters. Just pray that your daughter grows up and understands one day that you were looking out for him and her. She obviously isnt mature enough to handle the situation like an adult and do what is best/right. V, you do what you can to make sure everything is done to take care of her and him but once she turns 18 of course she is gonna want out of the house which is her choice and if she decides to do that she will be in a world of hurt. I would kill my daughter if she was old enough to do that stuff but she isnt so I am safe for now but the moment she does I have a list of 50 questions I am going to ask her. DO WHAT YOU NEED TO DO TO MAKE SURE HE IS TAKEN CARE OF. Your daughter will reject you and what not because she is upset and doesnt really understand where you are coming from. Just do what you feel is right and everything will turn out alright.

In my quest for better understanding, today I am going to see two counselors, a lawyer, and my doctor for some sleeping pills.

I'll know what my approach will be, after today, I think. I think it is going to be: Stop my part in escalating further (I already got what I needed). Work on the new phase of healing and rebuilding family although it will be a slow process. That is the hard part, and that is where I will need to develop a good plan.

Thank you for all the advice and discussion. This forum is great!! How else could I have recieved such a diverse and plentiful amount of ideas and opinions, which has helped me so much in giving me a wider understanding of this situation. Please keep them coming...

Is there anybody else who has gone through the identical situation or a similar one? Thanks 420star. If you get a chance, could you give me some more details?

In response to the original question, I feel the pain, but the father messed up the relationship with his daughter. Perhaps in the long term that will heal, but for right now, he took it too far. I'm not saying it's a great idea for 16 year olds to get pregnant, and it is not cool that this young guy got so involved, but it was pretty obvious from the start that this was going to adversely affect the relationship with the daughter. I'm sorry, a blind man could see that.

The question one has to ask is: Did Dad do this for his daughter, or did he do this for himself (to satisfy his own sense of "justice" and to alleviate his own "impotency"), given the likely outcome of all this in terms of ruining the father/daughter relationship?

What to do now? I have no idea...

Wow! Okay, so I have to ask... Why did you do this? Did you do this to protect your daughter, or to satisfy yourself? It looks like you were doing this purely for selfish reasons. The "I got what I needed" pretty much says that.

Well, since you've moved on to the next step, we wish you the best of luck with whatever happens next, and don't be afraid to ask us if you need help, or just a big e-hug to keep you going through hard times.

*shrug* I just don't understand how securing child support for his daughter can be seen as selfish, no matter how he words it. "I" is the most used word in the english language - it's use means practically nothing. The way I read that, "he" needed to secure the fact his daughter would receive child support for her child. Why did "he" need this? Because he's her father and "he" sees it as a duty of his to do what's best for his daughter. Let's not get into semantics here.

Not to mention that highthief is right - a blind man could have seen this would have an adverse effect on the father-daughter relationship. Clearly, this effect is upsetting to him, so if it were purely him being selfish I think it's pretty clear that he would not have gone through with this, doing so much damage to a relationship he clearly cares about. To draw a (bad) comparison, a person doesn't murder someone they LOVE for selfish reasons, they murder someone they DON'T love (or fell out of love with). Point is, if he cares about her - and it's obvious he does - he has no "selfish" reason to basically destroy his relationship with her.

I'm STILL trying to figure out where some people think she was supposed to get money to raise her child as well as herself after she turns 18 and while she's not receiving child support from the father.

I only got down to the quote above and wanted to add some thoughts...i can/will add some more later but...what shakran said above i totally agree in.

The only thing I am unsure of is if it was "rape" or was it just a teenager trying to rebel by having sex...also imo if her mother is laid back I am not surprised that this has happened sorry to say.

My sister and I dont have a relationship with our father after she got pregnant....lil story to help backup(make more sense) of what i am saying sorry if its too long.

My parents divorced about 10 years ago...i am 25 now and she(sister) is 26, Our "father"(so called) married the county slut and things went downhill from there but what put the icing on the cake, and where he decided to disown us, was that when my sister was pregnant with her son, now 2.5 years old, our "father" backed him up, giving him money and/or anything that would piss her(my sister) off or would help him(the father) get a better chance with his son, but our "father" would only do these things as long as he was allowed(by the babys father)to come to the visits. Anyway the father is lazy and wont work nor will he pay anything to help his son out and doesnt deserve to have much if anything to do with his son if he cant provide the necessary means for them to survive, let alone anything else. The only way my sister has survived this far was by living at home and our mother watches him during the day while she goes to work(more on this in another thread lol). Edit: Wanted to add that my sister was/is mature enough, even tho she did get pregnant.

I do agree that you will need to sit down with ur daughter and have an adult conversation, whatever you do, DO NOT loose ur temper. You may want to have your Ex there also as a witness. I have one child atm and another on the way so if i was in ur situation i would do some similar things. Also try talking to ur ex about these things, get her opinion if you havent already. Lastly, imo she needs to learn that she needs to depend on you and her mother's help cause her son depends on her. Hopefully this is all clear, if not i can clarify what i meant. Whatever happens tho I hope everything turns out for the best whatever that maybe. Good Luck!

Imo slimshaydee those two things are totally different!!!

He is more then just a sperm donor...that was what mine more or less was, but imo he is more of a "father" for sticking up for his daughter.

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Hear, hear Shakran!

I agree wholeheartedly with you.

This guy is 22, living with his mother, raping underaged girls and getting them pregnant, and then he does not even have the balls to get his name on the birth cirtificate, or pay to keep the child fed. Sounds real nice to me, great example of what a father should be like. I can just imagine what a kid will grow up like with his influence.

Victor, this guy belongs in jail. Push for the paternity test and child support.

When you do not need to pay child support anymore, don't. Do NOT, I repeat, DO NOT give her a single cent more than you are legaly obliged to. Have her learn that nothing in this world is free.

Your daughter has gotten the idea in her head that this "man" (and I use the word in its broadest possible sense) loves her, he's her knight in shining armor trotting along on his white horse, just waiting for his chance to rescue her from your brutal rule. Her head is filled with romantic dreams. She is obviously nowhere near mature enough to be having sex with an adult, nor to raise a child or make intelligent decisions in her life.

Cut her off. Make sure that she knows that she can come to you, but you are not in the wrong here. She is, and this guy is even more so.

At some point she will realise that she needs food, shelter etc. and that these things costs money.

This is a shitty situation to be in, I know. (actually I guess I don't, since I have never been in anything similar, and I am not a parent).

Hopefully she will realise why you did what you have when she grows up -- have you tried explaining it to her? Keep on trying to be part of her life and your grandson's.

Sometimes it sucks being a parent. This is one of those times. Your daughter thinks she knows best - don't cave - be the parent! I know - sounds like a motherfucker, but you have to do it! A little one has been brought into this world through no choice of its own. Now it's time for his/her parents to step up to the plate.

I just turned 18 this March, and I still don't know completely what is right for me. My parents would have done the same thing for me if I would have been in the same situation (and if I were a female), and I think I would appreciate it eventually. I realize that they knew mostly what was best for me all along.

I think you did the right thing. Hopefully someday she will see your decision as wise.

As for the monetary support, if she won't accept it (if this happens), maybe he can pay you and you put it in a trust for the child.

This guys is a complete ass hole and i believe you are doing the right thing. I know a girl who is 16 and her BF is 27 plus her parents dont seem to think its wrong, they are doing nothing. granted there is no baby but he is taking advantage of her in every way possible.

If he wont take responsibility for teh child then you need to make him, the mother isnt doing her job either. Where do you think she got the idea about having hte DAD not pay child support? i bet it was him. Your daughter has to know thats wrong but i figure this guy is very controlling of her and makes her dicisions for her.

best of luck to you

Statutory rape is has very limited valid applications. There is a point, such as in this case (in my opinion of course) where it becomes stupid, and should no longer apply. A four year difference, that close to age of majority (for both of them) is almost nothing. Factor in the concpet that female mature faster sexually than males do, and you've got them on practically equal footing.

To the thread creator: I think it was a bad move to press charges purely on the father being 20 and your daughter being 16. I've read through here that he seems not to be a good father however, and that does change my perspective a bit. I don't know that pressing charged was still the best choice, as it did alienate your daughter, but certainly something should be done.

Well, all arguments aside, I believe that since they have a kid, they've already had sex. So, that is a moot point. I think it boils down to are you in the wrong for pursuing what you think is right for your daughter? Hell no aren't. She is your daughter and involved father or not your one job is to see that she is raised as you see fit. Now the technique you choose to use to accomplish this is up for argument here.

I say, if you think you are hurting your relationship by doing what you are doing, then stop. Maybe it is just justice you are seeking, but whats more important is how capable she is when she is on her own in a few years. An idea you might try is to say, "Okay, I'm backing off like you asked." One of two things can happen, everything could work out perfectly and she is happy that you backed off, or everything could go as you might expect: father or baby never helps or pays, daughter realizes that she made a huge mistake and that this guy is scum(if he is) and then learns something from that mistake.

Either way, she is likely to succeed in bringing up the child whether this guy goes to jail or not, so is all that really worth messing up a potential relationship with your daughter.

On the otherhand, maybe you stepping in is a good thing. Maybe she'll end up better off, and 5 years down the road, she'll thank you for butting your nose into her business. I think you should do whatever you see fit and I'll certainly not judge your decision. My daughter is only 3, and I hope never to be in your position, but if ever I am, I'll expect other parents to allow me to parent as I see fit.

Good luck, I hope everything works out well.

Herk

Sometimes life just throws hard decisions in your path. The fact is that your decision to press the SR charges is one that you can never rescind. He is now a felon, with a sexually related charge against him. You did that. I am not sure which way I would have gone on it if I had been in your shoes. If I had not been in an active relationship with my daughter for an extended period and made my presence known by that kind of action, I would be a hypocrit for all that I do at this time, but not seeing your situation first hand I am hard pressed to judge it, as I think I don't have all the facts. On the one hand, you know that you destroyed your relationship with your daughter, on the gamble that some day she will realize that you are right. In that special area of sympathy most reserve for strangers, I hope it happens, and that it does sooner, rather then later, because as I stated, what you did has no practical way to be reversed. Once again, I am not judging, because I can not, but I hope it was worth the price, and my hat is off for making the decision that you did. I am sure it took a hell of a lot to do it.

Personally I think you did right by her. If she can't see that what you've done is what she SHOULD have done already then that's her problem. Granted it's driven an wede between you and your daughter but that's her wedge that's there not yours IMHO.

My parents set very strict bounderies for me. Strangely enough they weren't nearly as strict with my younger brother. I ended up getting into trouble the minute I was out of the home because I so desperately felt I needed that outside control. I allowed myself to be controlled by an abusive boyfriend because it was comfortable. When I finally got away from all that control I had to learn to control myself. That was hard. But I think I learned it and learned not to be dependant on others for control over me. I said all that to say this. Your bounderies were intended to help. It seems they've not done what you desired. Now I think, especially since she's getting close to 18, it would be a good idea for you to step back and let her be. She refuses to talk to you? Don't try to talk to her. Sell that car, put the money into a savings account, but don't tell her about it. Save the money, if you are still afraid of her future, for when she has hit rock bottom and comes to you admitting that you're fears for her were justified. When you can see she's learned what she needs to from this then you can help her.

My younger brother who had few bounderies from my parents ended up pushing the limit in other ways. He literally dared my parents to set bounderies for him and they never did so until they were physically harmed by him. Some kids need more control and some need less but in the end they all need to learn to control themselves on their own. I fear the day that I have to step back and let my daughter deal with all her problems on her own as an adult. I know I will have to though.

Step back, let her deal with life, and let her know that you will be there when it all come crumbling down. Perhaps then you both can heal your wounds.

Okay, I'll admit all I did was read the original post, but I want to be able to say my opinion/thoughts before reading everything else.

My parents always told me that if I were to get pregnant and the guy was 18, they'd press charges, even if I didn't want them to. My feelings on the subject are and were that if I seduced him and I wasn't held down and raped against my will, it's just as much my fault as his. When a girl is sixteen, she's old enough to know what she's doing and old enough to HAVE to accept the consequences. If the guy wants to accept the responsibility also and be a part of that child's life, let them be married and deal with it together.

HOWEVER. I also see your point of view and wanting to protect your daughter and your grandchild. Still, if she doesn't feel victimized, then take that into consideration. Sometimes you need to let your kid figure shit out on their own. She's going to feel the way she feels no matter what, and she may or may not get over it. Is it worth losing your daughter and your grandson (whom you obviously love)?

Well put sillygirl. I really like your last paragraph.

I'm not sure it is up to 3rd parties though to say when a person is ready to be held responsible for their decisions. We have to go by one of two ages: the one the law implements or the one the parent implements. All people are different and need to be raised based on that. Not one parenting technique will work for all. So maybe, because of that, some 14 year olds are responible enough to be held responsible. On the other hand, others struggle with self-responsibility up to and past 18, but that is where the law steps in.

"Sometimes you need to let your kid figure shit out on their own."
This is one of the most correct viewpoints I think a parent can have. Now, I don't think a parent should eschew teaching, but some things must just be learned by doing.

Herk

Update
 

Well, I decided to do two things...back off now and let her make all her own legal decisions, and to write my daughter a letter clearing up my side of the street, and apologizing for the mistakes I made in some of my approaches.

About the same time I was deciding how to word the letter, my ex called and told me that I could come and see the baby (my grandson) while my daughter was out at school, which I did. Man, I missed him! But I felt sneaky. A few days later, my ex called and said that my daughter said I could go over there any time that she wasnt there and see the baby.

I wrote the letter, and took it over there and left it for her. I told her that I regretted going to court against her (the same result would have happened had I not gone to court), and told her that she was now an adult in my eyes, and could make all her own decisions and live with the results, that I would not be contacting courts, probation officers, child support agencies, etc. That I would not be escalating the situation any further, and that my only efforts would be towards healing our relationship.

She called me up that night and thanked me for the letter, told me I could come over any time I wanted to see the baby and her, and that she was sorry too for her anger.

IN RETROSPECT:

I think I took the correct approach...tough at first and then loosening up. The young man in question will see his charges reduced to a misdemeanor in 18 months (he's halfway there) if he stays out of trouble. After that, one good letter to the judge by his PO and myself (with my daughter's permission) will certainly result in having the conviction expunged completely from his record, or so I have been assured. So I think he will have learned, and grown up, without any permanent damage in the long run (it wasn't murder, after all). He has been ordered to get paternity tested, and that will cause child support to automatically happen, but that is no longer my business. I'll just trust that that will happen. I will financially help my daughter while she is in school, like I have always promised.

My daughter and I both learned, I think, that preserving our relationship and love, is more important than the details of life, no matter how troublesome, contentious, or provocative they may be. Neither of us liked what we had become, and the pain we both had to endure. We are still a long way from healing our relationship, but we are on the path, for the first time in several years. She agreed to go to counseling with me, which is a first for her.

I want to thank all of you who offered your perspectives and you honest feedback. They really helped me in formulating an approach to take with this. I don't know what I would have done without this forum. How else could I have gotten such a wide variety of input? And thank you as well, for your best wishes that were offered so many times. I guess that we can now close this thread, unless anybody has any final comments. I will post updates if and when things change. :thumbsup:

Peace.

I didn't read the thread, but pressing charges against the guy was a terrible, terrible thing to do. I mean, wow.

Looks like you handled it rather well from there, victor. I must admit, I didn't expect an outcome quite that good after reading your opening post. :)

I'm tearing up over here from that last post, victorjara. I'm so glad that the damage is being repaired by everyone.

glad to hear that things are getting better, the letter you wrote will go a long way in erasing old memories and making new ones as a happy family! also glad to hear that the dude will be paying up some child support as all parent should!

It makes me happy to hear things are panning out. I was worried about the long term for you. I'm am glad things are looking up for you.

Yeah. Throw the 22-year-old in jail, so the taxpayer will foot the bill for his living expenses. Right.

He didn't have sex with a child, he had sex with a minor. I'm 27 and I'm still my father's child, but I am not a minor as of 18 years of age. The law states that a 16 year old is a minor, but it doesn't specify him/her as a child. Make of that difference what you will, it's there. And by my personal standards, a 16 year old is not a child, albeit being a minor. Anyway, so much for that.

I don't know if I will have anything to say that hasn't been said already. One thing I definitely do not understand is why you're holding child support as some sort of a ticket or license for the father to see his child. Especially when his child is as little as he is. Has the guy had ample time to come to terms with the fact that he is a father, or did you slap those charges on him before the child was even born? Not all men are made equal, or even of the same mold. You seem to be doing quite well for yourself, and judging by your vocabulary as well as your ideals and moral standing I'd go as far as to guess that you didn't grow up on the streets, either. This "loser", as you have stamped him, has not established his place in life and isn't making even minimum wage. Instead of offering this new family your emotional support and love as they figure out what is happening and where they go from here, you attack them with every legal weapon you've got.

Someone mentioned that as long as young people feed off of their parents financially, they have to abide by their parents' wishes. This is total bullshit, if you ask me. If you write checks for your kids, you're doing it out of your own free - or perhaps not so free - will. You can choose either to help your child financially, or not to. Either way you should not expect your checks to purchase you some leverage in telling her how to run her life. Your decision to help should come without strings attached, or else it is an act of selfishness in my book.

Victor, your daughter is a mother now, at a relatively young age. If a young mother of a child needs anything, it is confidence and the ability to trust those around her. By treating her the way you have, you are not only making yourself untrustworthy in a time of need, but your actions are also questioning and undermining her ability to run her own life. This can very easily translate in her mind to you suggesting that she is not and will not be a fit mother to her child.

How about you take a step back and ask yourself, what is it that you have done that has earned you the right to remain involved in your daughter's and your grandson's lives? Other than the money you throw around.

Did you not read his last post? Things are working out.

UPDATE
 

Update: Paternity test shows guy not the dad :crazy: . Family thrown into chaos once again. Daughter hates me again for pushing for test. Young man was contributing (ever so slightly) to child and bonded a bit. Child 1.3 years old. I feel it was important to know the truth, get child support if it was his, and not pin this on the guy if it was not his.

I still kept my promise not to interfere. The paternity test was court ordered from previous, although I did want it, did pay for it, and did coordinate the taking of samples.

Feedback??

Actually, all this time it seemed more like you were 500 % sure the kid was his, which is why you pushed for the test when she didn't; you wanted him to have to be financially responsible.

I'm sure he feels relieved about that, in more ways than one.

But you still get to have him prosecuted for his crime against humanity, so all's well I suppose.

I worked in the Louisiana state child support enforcement office for the last five years. I've seen more than my share of women who've named one man as the father, and fight and fight to get money from him. Several years later, the man decides to get his shit straight and asks for a blood test, and lo and behold the kids aren't his. There's no way to get the money back that he's spent, his credit is still fucked up and the kids are once again without a father. This doesn't serve anyone worth a damn.

I went back and read the original post... I personally don't think you did a damn thing wrong, and a lot of things right. I know right now that your family is all in chaos again. Remind your daughter that you and she have already settled your own differences, the test is in the past, and what's done is done, and that you have every intention of sticking with your word. I would tell her that if she wants to name another boy the father, that you will support what she wants....

As far as I'm concerned, the statutory rape charge against the first boy didn't have anything to do with the baby: he pled guilty, which means he had sex with her. That doesn't automatically mean he fathered the child. I'd also look into your state's child support enforcement office.... Usually offered through Social Services, it offers women the opportunity for a mediary to collect their support, usually there is free legal help, and paternity tests (well, the father is responsible for the paternity test costs if he tests positive as the father). Sometimes there is a fee, but I know that in Louisiana, the fee is waived for mothers on welfare or any state assistance.

Good luck. This is a sticky situation....

If you try to force her to do anything she will probably do the exact opposite, my sister (17) just had a child 10 months ago and we have been going through the same thing minus the statory charges, and you cannot tell her to do anything but I wonder it know it sounds awful but try to get custody of the child if she goes back with him and he does not man up. I have been trying to get my mom to do that cause my sister is defiently not responible enough for a child, she has never even had a job, so I am not sure how responsible your daughter is but if she is not responisble you have to do it for the childs sake.

your daughter is now angry because she's been outed as 'promiscuous' and its probably embarrasing to her. You now have an opportunity to bring your family back on track as the head of the family. You can accept, and go on, that this guy isn't the father but still accept him and let him be the father(if thats what he chooses to do since he's bonded with the kid) and let your daughter know that its no longer important to you who specifically the father is. Let her know that the past is the past and from this point forward you go on with your lives and work out your differences.

Over parenting now will not correct the problems your daughter is encountering now. You cannot change the fact that she is a mother. Like it or not, you're gonna have to let her peddle this bike on her own. She may fall, she may ride it okay. You need to be able to pick her up when she stumbles.
She obviously has issues with defiance, her choice of friends in her life shows that. If you push her to rid herself of this guy, she will push back.
We all make mistakes. Some people make bigger ones than others. This is one hopefully she will learn from. Give her a little time. Realize this father is in your life forever. He will always be around. You can choose to fight with them, or seek solutions together. Isn't the most important thing right now helping your daughter learn/educate herself enough to get a decent paying job to support her & her child?
Make that your battle.
By the way, I was stupid & got pregnant by a "rebel" dude when I was barely eighteen. I had to learn on my own I had made a big mistake. Happily divorced now, I support my kids all on my own. She'll come around, but it will take time. If my Dad had done the same things you did, I would have acted the same way. Don't we all think we are smarter than our parents at that age?
Good luck with this. You'll need patience & nerves of steel. At least when her world crumbles out from under her, she has a caring Dad to come to.

I'm glad you updated, because now I get to tell you this and know you'll read it.

Well, your language and style from your original posts indicated to me that being a figure of authority came first, and being a father second. This is never the way to go, even if your goals were admirable or even (perceived by you) "correct".

So, not to be crass- but now you've proved your grand point, you've guarded the world against the evils of a 20-year old (who wasn't even the father, as it turns out) on your 16-year-old daughter. In the process, you've alienated your daughter to the point she won't even take a car from you.

I'll be waiting for the "my daughter turned 18 today and all her stuff is gone and I can't find her or my grandchild" thread. Maybe you'll luck out and she'll leave a note. And hey, if you're really lucky, she won't "cuss you out" on it.

I'm not trying to flame anyone here, but you're giving us this story and this is my honest opinion of the words you've strewn across the board here.

I'm not a parent and don't plan on becoming one, and I have no other input to this thread except IT WASN'T RAPE BECAUSE THEY BOTH CONSENTED TO HAVING SEX. STOP CALLING IT RAPE. STOP IT.

Sorry, it's just a little pet peeve I have.

Hey slim....are you yourself a parent? I'm just curious about where your experience came from to reach this conclusion. I'm not trying to start any du du here but what might help you see things differently is to put yourself in victorjara's position. Try for a moment to see the world through his eyes and stop reacting to what you perceive through yours.


victorjara I am not a parent and I don't know how I would have reacted were I in this situation. I hope that in time your duaghter will realize you want what's best for her in this world and that you can both work together to put that picture in place.

I'm not too sure to say it wasn't rape. But here's my take on it. It is considered rape because she's 16 and unable to think (I'm not generalising that all 16 yr olds are unable to think.. but to say that by most people's point of view, it is so) about the consequences of sex, thus persuaded by a more matured and slick man to be able to find his way into bed with her.

So in that sense, it is rape. Though consented, it may be due to trickery, or the inability to think of the consequences. :)

well get over it. It IS rape. It's called statutory rape. That means that theres a statute in that state that says 16 year olds are UNABLE to consent to sexual relations with adults.

Some day, when you have a 16 year old daughter, you'll know exactly what statutory rape means.

Your daughters last reply in your original post is not really a surprise to me. You started things off badly by pressing charges. You jumped to conclusions about your grandsons father and therefore, have made it harder for him "to step up and be a man".

You're daughter may have been young, but she makes her own choices. If her baby's father was about to skip town, beating your daughter, threatening to take the child, etc. - these are reasons for pressing Statutory rape charges. Which, by the way, you've just ruined that young man's chances at some of the best jobs on the market; many companies are changing their hiring policies and will not consider a candidate for hire - Even After Seven + Years!

You are punishing your daughter and her child by not allowing the father in their life...in my opinion, you went about this all wrong.

If this exact situation occured in Australia, it'd not have been a crime.

We don't let little kids play with loaded revolvers, because it's pretty clear from past instances that bad things will happen. Whatever your take on religion, clearly 16 year olds aren't going to be stable parents, and it is just going to mess up her life and chances to acquire the stability that she would need to one day become a good parent. It is not the fault of those on welfare that they are there, people don't choose their education, upbringing, or life circumstances that lead to one's station in life at 16; but it is clear that while welfare is a stopgap to keep people from falling too far, it does little to help them become productive members of society. It is usually too late. Yeah, 16 year olds are dumb, they have sex, they're just kids, whatever- but the guy should know better. 20 to 15/16 is okay, but 20 to 12 isn't? 20 to 8? It's not religion, it's common sense.
The father is clearly not responsible or intelligent enough to care for the baby on his own, so the law should compel him to, just like Vic is trying to have accomplished. He is half-responsible for that kid, so whatever your take on breadwinning, he should at least pay his share.

i don't have kids but had fate dealt me a slightly different hand, i easily could have been in this situation when i was your daughter's age. she may be coming up on 18, but she is still a child. if you are anything like my parents, you prolly have to keep reminding yourself she isn't twelve anymore :)


i've read the entire thread and imo, your best bet is to give serious consideration to what you want (for yourself, for your daughter and for your grandson). does it really matter to you who the father is? if not, tell your daughter it doesn't matter. if you think it is important, tell her why but don't shove it down her throat. there are a lot of very good reasons why she may want to find out. what happens if she needs to know the father's medical history for her child? what is she going to tell him when her son asks about his father? if she manages to get by with a vague response as he gets older--what happens when he's an adult and decides he wants to look for his father? she's denying her son a lot by not knowing, even if she has no desire to enter into a relationship with the father or get child support from him.

if i were in your shoes, i know i'd want what was best for my daughter and grandchild. to me, that means i have to be in their lives. some may say let her go her own way, but personally i wouldn't be willing to take that kind of risk. i know i don't always take the path my parents would have chosen for me, but at least i (now) know that they will support me in whatever choice i do make. there are a lot of bad places for a teen mother and her child to end up and i really don't think you want that for your family. tough love may sound like a good idea to some, but if things don't work out ok, are you going to be able to live with that choice? could you go on with no regrets never knowing what happened to your daughter and grandson? not knowing if they were alive or dead? if you can, then by all means take that path if you feel it is the best decision you can make. but if you don't know with certainty that you could let her out of your life forever and not ever feel responsible for what happens, then i suggest you do whatever you have to do to keep her in your life.

i know your daughter is angry at you. maybe she even knew that this guy wasn't going to be the dad and that's why she was so angry you insisted on the paternity test. right now, you need to let her know where you stand on the situation. if you don't care who the father is, tell her that. let her know that you will support whatever decision she chooses to make on this (keep in mind that while you may only want what you feel is best for her, those are decisions that she will also have to live with and if they aren't what she wants that is going to piss her off even more).

there is so much your daughter and grandson need from you, and i don't mean money. you have a lifetime of experiences to draw from as a parent and a person. my parents are in their 50's, their parents have passed on but i know that not a day goes by when they don't wish they could ask them for advice about something. parents are one of the most valuable resources we have, even if we don't always realize it.

my best advice to you is to offer to be her father. support her (this doesn't mean financial if you aren't comfy with that) and love her. find out what she wants for herself and the baby then help her find a way to get it. if that means babysitting while she goes to class or studies, do it. if it means helping her find a job or career that will allow her to support her and her child while still doing something she takes pride in and enjoys, help her. if it means watching her fall flat on her butt as she tries to figure out her life, watch her and then help her back up. be her shoulder to cry on, be there to give her love and support, be her sounding board, be whatever she needs you to be. you're her dad, that's what you're for.

i agree with suave..

personally when i was 13 i started dating a 17 year old...when he was 18 i was 14...we did end up having sex...i truly loved him ...even that young you can still have intense emotions... she had sex with someone a few years older and got pregnant...shes going to have to suffer for her actions for the rest of her life..did you ever think that she would need emtional support insted of trying to rip away a guy she cares about and deny her at least that for what? your own selfish reasons? were you there for her before? doesnt seem like it so why teh hell do you have the right to do this now...she wasnt raped she had sex and if you want to be there why cant you actually be there for her? my parents werent happy that i waas with an older guy..but they would never have pressed charges..they loved me enough to know that i needed him around and put aside their own feelings about it

This message has been deleted.

You are too rigid Victor. You appeared absolutely unbending in your adherence to the rules above protecting this girl as your flesh and blood...but as time took it's toll you SLOWLY softened.

This guy isn't even her father...there's the rubb eh. No offense Victor, I don't know you beyond what I have seen posted here, but you seem like an overpious, by the books to the T kind of person. Your daughter obviously isn't...throw in the fact that you weren't a huge part of her life, and then here you stepped in, invoking legal means you didn't have to. Man, all you had to do was ask yourself...why was my daughter looking for love in these places? You didn't take her side--you didn't have her back when she needed you post. You instead chose to throw the book at her.

It's not a matter of setting boundaries. At that point you have to step in as a father and find out WHY she was having sex at that age...why she was hanging out with gang bangers. Man that guy she was with didn't even give her the baby...I don't think any of you realize how deep into that scene she might have been.

Do you even know they're gang bangers? You say the boy came to court in a t-shirt down his knees, but that's also just hip hop style today, and a lot of respectable kids are just into that style.

I don't know man, this is really a mess...just talk to your daughter, and ask her the things you want to know. Don't give your own opinions, don't berate...just listen. Think outside of your own personality--don't look at this situation from your own point of view. It's a hard concept, but shed all of your prejudices, all of your religious beliefs, all your morals. Just look at this for what it is...a young confused girl making some mistakes. Be a father and help her find her way again through compassion and understanding. You've gotta bend or you're not going to be able to hold the weight from all this emotional baggage forever and you're going to break.

here's my 2 cents, I met my wife when I was 19, she was 17 at the time. after about 6 months of dateing she became pregnant.

Now, at the time..her Dad could have had me locked up but he didn't, and I honestly believe that if he had, my life would have gone a different way.

My wife and I celbrated our 14th wedding aniversary last month.

nuff said?

I feel for you, but................ pressing charges making ti so he cant see her or the child.. then wanting child support? that is a little drastic. As much as you hate the idea he is the father no matter what.
He was in the wrong, yes, but you need to accept how your daughter feels.

If you had a son who was 20 and got someone elses daughter preg how would you react when he was denied seeing the child.would it really be fair

i am on yourside 85% but "it happens" and you have got a tad two far in my eyes. think from both sides. I understand its your little girl, but shes gotta grow up... and that the hardest part of being a father

letting the little girls gor up

you should have been straight forward with your daughter about sed and condoms... possibly getting her on the patch the pill or have her get the shot . the show wont protect against aids or such, but she would not get preg.

EVERYONE needs to have sex education when they are 11 -13 thats when they get the urges... use a condom use a condom use a condom

I don't know if this has already been addressed, but you basically permanently screwed her. The father of her child is now a felon incapable of getting a real job. She can never do well financially, and if she leaves she will be a single mother at the age of 18.

The term Maturity is one of the most misused words I've ever seen. Teenagers are not mature now and never have been. Having sex, taking drugs, and even sounding intelligent does not make someone mature. If you look closer you'll notice how off the priorities are. Then again, that's true of most of the population.

teens will have sex no matter what you say. if and when i have a daughter she will take birthcontrol. I would mostlikley have her go with the shot.it wont protect her from any aids,herpes or anything like that but it would protect her from getting preg

You asked at one point about advice from people in similar situations, I'm going to come at you from the perspective of your grandson and post something I almost can't believe hasn't really come up yet.

While the situation surrounding my birth was not all together as scandalous, the reactions of all parties involved were pretty much indistinguisably similar. Mind you my dad speaks english, but he already had another son to a different, older(than himself) woman, than my mother. He was 18 and I'm almost certain was not paying child support on his other son. You can bet my mother's father was really happy about this. But..with me he did what I'm sure you wanted this guy to do, he went out started working 2 and 3 jobs at a time, whatever he could to do to bring home the most money to give me the best life he could. He stepped up to the plate and became a man. I'm also pretty sure you going to want to find out who the father really is and have him do the same. Man or not, I'm going to tell you something I think you really really really....(continued indefinitely)...need to hear, something I so badly wish I could go back and tell my dad.

Being the breadwinner is the absolute least important responsibility you have as a father.

I mean that in my heart. I would have given every luxury I had as a child if it meant my dad was going to be home more, and when he was home he had the energy to do anything. I'm here to tell you, playing catch with my dad(or hell, even watching the grass grow with him) would have meant more than any amount of anything tangible he gave me, sometimes even including the food on the table.

Don't get me wrong, I lived a happy life for the most part, my dad did the best he could but he cared more about being a man than being a dad, and for a good part of my childhood I hated him for it. Now I understand why he did what he did and that it was the best he knew how to do but that doesn't mean I'm happy about it. I now think I'm going to have to go revise that 'the last time I cried post'...

After reading your current situation I think the best way to solve your family being in chaos is to let your daughter lead from here in any way she is able to and help her in any way you can. She is to the point where she has to be held accountable for her descisions and has to start being in control of her own life. I'm am going to choose to believe she has matured considerably through the course of having a child. I will say this, even thought it may seem contrary, when you really believe she is going to make a(nother) hugely damaging mistake, don't be afraid to put your foot down. I don't care what anyone says, at 16(I'm now 20) I thought I knew everything. Now I realize that when I was 16, I. didn't. have. a. fucking. clue. what I was doing. Really, if you want to get into it, I didn't know what I was doing last week. People of all ages make mistakes, I think the most important role you can play as a parent is to try to minimilize the truly damaging mistakes, and letting them make a few not so damaging mistakes, if simply to prove you do know what your talking about. *flashback to licking that 9V battery even though mom said it wasn't a good idea*. You seem like a good guy and a top notch dad in that you have her best interests are heart. But like I said, people of all ages make mistakes, don't be afraid to admit it. You can choose to not listen to any of this last paragraph, after all, I'm still a just kid. But I won't forgive you for ignoring the rest, and niether will your daugter or grandson.

Don't know if you're still reading this, but .....

I have yet to figure out what you wanted to accomplish by pressing charges. Getting the father classified as a felon, so he couldn't provide much child support?

There are a great many bitter men out there, who write a check every month, but aren't allowed to see their kid(s). Also not a good way to ensure reliable child support. That would appear to be moot, since he's not the father. However, if and when you find out who the father really is, I think you should approach the matter differently. In other words, get child support, but don't get him declared a felon.

Along those lines, although I'm not a lawyer, I think it would be a big mistake to sue for visitation rights, if things deteriorate with your daughter. First, it's unlikely to prevent your daughter from moving to another state if she gets mad enough. Secondly, woe be unto you if the child should get injured while in your care. Thirdly, if your daughter is REALLY mad, she can do what so many other angry women do--accuse you of molesting the child. I don't know your daughter, but this happens routinely in divorce cases.

As the father of a daughter, my advice would be to do nothing the daughter doesn't ask you to do, and that means quit trying to force her to do what YOU want. It won't work anyway until she realizes that your advice is good, and unfortunately, that may be years from now.

Once the child support stops, she's going to have some hard choices. At that time, you can lay out your ground rules: If she wants support from you, you'll provide a roof over her head, food to eat, maybe a few clothes. Baby sitting, if it's convenient for YOU. Education expenses if things work out that way. But no cash!!!!

One more little kicker for you: I can't remember where I read it, but many states are so broke now that they're legally requiring GRANDPARENTS to provide financial support for their grandchildren.

You might want to talk to your lawyer about what you should do to stay out of that situation.

I hope this wasn't harsh, and I wish you the best.

You did the right thing but handled it badly with regards to talking about it with your daughter from what i can gather, a lot of the posters seem to think that the father, due to the closeness of your daughters age to the legal age of consent did no wrong- but I completely disagree - he should be held accountable, From what i can pick up some people think that at 15 you are able to make responsible decisions about sex, well obviously not - but at 20 you should.