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Politics On gender politics

Discussion in 'Tilted Philosophy, Politics, and Economics' started by Shadowex3, Nov 3, 2013.

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  1. Bodkin van Horn

    Bodkin van Horn One of the Four Horsewomyn of the Fempocalypse

    I think you guys have wandered into someone else's gunfight. I'm not sure who shadowex is fighting, but he has made you them with no regard to your actual themness.
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  2. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    I have suspected this in the past, but now it is abundantly clear.
  3. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    It would make a good basis for a Monty Python sketch.
  4. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor


    It has seemed that way for some time.
    I had started feeling like I missed an entire thread someplace.
  5. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    These last few posts? This is what gaslighting looks like Baraka. Although I'm sure you know that.
  6. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    I would buy that if we didn't have ample evidence in the shape of your posting history to offer a completely different narrative than the one you are trying to tell.

    I know am talking to the wind, but you could have won many more people over to your point of view if you weren't such an asshole about trying to be right. You are so convinced of the righteousness of your cause that you can't conceive of a common ground. For you, it's win at all cost. Scorched earth be damned!

    You aren't interested in discussion. Just being right. And when called on you garbage, you lash out accusing people of the very same thing you just did to them.

    Perhaps you should consider that there might be a reason why people here react to you the way they do.

    Hint: it's not because they are feminists.
  7. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    What you have evidence of is the lot of you starting out from post one treating me like utter shit and being so hostile, so vicious, that you scared other people out of posting for fear they'd be next. I put up with it for years because I let you all convince me that it was me, that it was in my head, I was just the horrible asshole misogynist you all made me out to be until I heard from those other posters that they saw the same things I did but weren't brave enough to stand up to the sheer level of abuse you all hurled at me. Each and every one of you has consistently refused to even consider the possibility that any disagreement with the feminist party line could ever be legitimate. Your talk of "common ground" is belied by your proven refusal to accept anything less than total and utter capitulation to feminist orthodoxy.

    And through all of this you continue to slap each other on the back about how star spangled f'ing awesome you all are and how I'm the one that's guilty of everything you do, even when you're not even reading my posts to such a point that you're tripping over each other instead of anything I said.

    Sorry folks, not falling for that cheap trick again. What you do here is textbook DARVO. Deny you're abusive, vicious, and dishonest. Attack me for saying it. Reverse Victim and Offender and claim I'm the one doing it to you.

    And Baraka has the balls to try and claim that I'm the one gaslighting him.
  8. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    That might be true if it weren't for the evidence of the contrary on one hand and a lack of evidence on the other. Pesky thing reality is sometimes.

    If you have no interest in demonstrating your ridiculous claims, I'm not interested in the ranting of someone who eschews reason and plays victim.

    I've had enough manipulators in my life and know their game.
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2014
  9. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    Again, textbook gaslighting. And oh the irony that you describe the hypoagency, fearmongering, and damseling/Victim Cred manufacturing of feminism so succinctly... Anita and Zoe and pretty much all of modern fear-feminism summed up in a single sentence. I wonder are you really so utterly self-unaware, or do you know what you're saying and you say it anyway because you're a politician?
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2014
  10. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    No evidence, no credibility. Only faith, delusion, and propaganda.

    You're like a creationist of gender politics.

    You do even the MRM a gross disservice.
  11. Street Pattern

    Street Pattern Very Tilted

  12. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    You are talking about yourself here.

    I hope you enjoy talking to yourself because your attitude does not encourage anyone to engage with you.

    I am getting PMs from people saying they would like to participate in the discussion but don't want to deal with your bullshit.

    Why not just take your talking points to a blog and have at it?
  13. Shadowex3

    Shadowex3 Very Tilted

    The wikipedia article's been hijacked by anti-gamergate polemecists badly enough that Jimmy Wales himself had to publicly say he was considering banning a bunch of people. Tech Crunch has a good article.

    Enough irony to build an aircraft carrier. I've caught each one of you ignoring my posts to the point you were going after each other instead of me purely because you were paying that little attention and simply reflexively opposing everything you thought I'd said. You don't want a discussion, you want a hugbox. From post one in the first feminism thread years ago none of you have been willing to accept anything other than total capitulation. You can't have a discussion when you predicate the entire concept of morality and correctness on whether or not something agrees with you.

    "You don't have any evidence."
    *Provides evidence*
    "That doesn't count. Why don't you have any evidence?"
    *Provides more evidence*
    "Those aren't TRUE feminists, they don't count, why don't you have any evidence?
    *Provides even MORE evidence*
    "That's not evidence that's <insert handwave>. Why can't you ever provide any evidence? You're like the creationist of gender politics!"

    No evidence because you never accept anything that contradicts feminism, no credibility because your definition of credible is agreeing with feminism, delusion and propaganda because nothing which disagrees with feminist dogma can ever be true.
  14. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    This is hilarious because I was referring to any evidence regarding your claims about me. (Try to pay attention.)

    Instead you've posted more false claims.

    It's like you do it on purpose.
  15. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage

    To infinity and beyond.


  16. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    • Strawmen
    • False dilemmas
    • Arguments from omniscience
    • Moving the goalposts
    • Irrelevant conclusions
    • Faulty generalizations
    • Tu quoques
    • Guilt by association
    • Burden of proof
    • Texas sharpshooter fallacies
    • Ad hominems
    • Confirmation bias
    • Half truths
    • Loaded questions
    These problems (and a few others) are at the core of most "arguments" by @Shadowex3 in this thread. When they're pointed out overtly, or even if refuted less formally, they aren't handled as they should. Instead, we get the "I know you are but what am I?" mentioned above.

    We don't even get to agree or disagree with the positions based on the content because we need to point out the obvious logical fallacies. It's a structural issue. However, in response, we simply get blind accusations of using the selfsame fallacies. Unfortunately, ad hominem is a terrible way to field rebuttals on logical grounds. This is why we never get anywhere in this thread.

    Despite my own efforts at being fair in addressing the problems, I'm accused of treating him like "utter shit" the whole time. I do admit taking an adversarial tone at times, but this is rooted in frustration, not any intent to disrespect. My pointing out logical problems and my getting defensive with someone because they say misleading or false things about me isn't treating that someone like "utter shit." Although this is just my own opinion, I must say I have treated him with more respect than he's deserved based on his behaviour in this thread.

    This thread is a logical train wreck despite the best efforts of those who want to keep things going, to actually discuss something.

    Instead, what we have—from my perspective at least—is that @Shadowex3 has decided what my opinions are for me.

    @Shadowex3 : Thanks but no thanks. Regardless, it's too late for me to share my opinions here. I'm now too afraid to share them. Every time I see that you've responded to one of my posts here, I experience a brief anxiety attack, knowing that you've probably attacked my character or made things up about me again. Imagine how I'd feel if I were to share more deeply what I really think about feminism and gender politics.

    Congratulations. You've shat all over your own thread.
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2014
  17. Borla

    Borla Moderator Staff Member

    -+-{Important TFP Staff Message}-+-
    I'm going to step in and lock this discussion, as it has went far beyond any usefulness.

    A comment for @Shadowex3 , for whatever it is worth. I want to be clear that this is my personal opinion, not staff policy or a board decision to tell you this.

    I don't identify as a "feminist". Anyone who cares to dig through my posting history here will find that my comments are limited on most social and political issues, as I feel arguing about them on the internet has an infinitesimal chance of any positive result other than assuring me that I'm right and so much smarter than anyone who disagrees with me. ;) I have a massive amount of respect for women as a gender (they are my favorite gender, I promise), I strive to treat them respectfully, as individuals, and to judge them all on their specific personal abilities. But I'm not one to be an activist in either direction...........I give that preface because I want to make it clear that my comments to follow are not directed at your opinions on this subject. So here goes........if you want anyone to take you seriously on any subject that you feel so obviously passionate about, you need to find a different strategy than screaming that you are a victim or repetitive argumentum ad hominem. Speaking as an outside observer who has no real personal relationship with anyone on either side of this debate, I found most of your accusations to extremely detract from any points you were trying to make. Most of them seemed to be huge leaps from reality, and I found them to often be incredulous. In the future, I'd suggest dialing the emotion down from about "11" to maybe a "3". Stop seeing ghosts and enemies where there are only differing thoughts and values. Quit referring to ambiguous but anonymous supporters, be a big boy and own your own thoughts (and allow others to own theirs if they want to speak up). And relax. Really, just take a breath and relax. This is one of the most laid back, least judgmental, and most accepting spaces I've ever found online. Someone here disagreeing hardly means they think you are the Devil incarnate, so don't try to read that into their disagreement. ;)

    My $.02. May only be worth what you paid for it...
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