Killer Planned To Eat 10-Year Old Girl - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

lindalove · 04-17-2006, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Killer Planned To Eat 10-Year Old Girl

Man held in 10-year-old’s death allegedly fantasized about cannibalism

PURCELL, Okla. - A slain 10-year-old girl’s body, found in her downstairs neighbor’s apartment, had deep saw marks on the neck, said authorities who alleged Saturday that her killer had planned to dismember her and eat the flesh.

The family of Jamie Rose Bolin was in shock, not only with the news of her slaying but with the fact that she apparently died so close to home.

Kevin Ray Underwood, 26, was arrested Friday after investigators found Jamie’s body in the closet of a bedroom in his apartment, authorities said. The girl’s unclothed body was inside a large plastic tub, along with a towel used to soak up blood, officials said.

Purcell police Chief David Tompkins said investigators think the killer hit her several times with a wooden cutting board, then placed his hand and duct tape over her mouth to suffocate her. She was sexually assaulted after she died, officials said.

Tompkins and McClain County District Attorney Tim Kuykendall released the gruesome details about the final moments of Jamie’s life and what they alleged were Underwood’s plans for her body, but they would not say whether Underwood had confessed to the slaying.

Police: Other children targeted
Kuykendall said that Underwood said he began fantasizing about eating someone a year ago. The prosecutor added that authorities believe “that while she was ultimately chosen to be the victim of this horrific crime, that other people had been targeted and considered,” including a a woman and a 5-year-old boy.

A preliminary autopsy report said the girl died from blunt force trauma to the head and asphyxiation.

“Regarding a potential motive, this appears to have been part of a plan to kidnap a person, rape them, torture them, kill them, cut off their head, drain the body of blood, rape the corpse, eat the corpse, then dispose of the organs and bones,” the police chief said.

Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation agents seized a decorative dagger, a hack saw, duct tape, meat tenderizer, barbecue skewers, a duffel bag, the cutting board, a computer, and a videotape about a serial killer, Tompkins said.

Police think Jamie died Wednesday, the day she was last seen at the library in Purcell, about 20 miles south of Oklahoma City. She was reported missing that night.

“Jamie was in the apartment below us the whole time,” said Rose Fox, Jamie’s grandmother. “The only reason that he couldn’t move the body and hide it was because somebody was out there the whole time, either on the balcony smoking or standing in front of the apartment.

Behavior aroused suspicion
Authorities said they became suspicious of Underwood when he pulled up to a check point set up near the apartment complex two days after the girl was reported missing.

“He was an occupant of a vehicle. He just wasn’t acting right,” said Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper Kera Philippi. “From there, they talked to him and the FBI took him into questioning.”

Underwood was being held Saturday in the McClain County Jail on a complaint of first-degree murder, a jail official said.

The district attorney called Jamie’s killing one of the most “heinous and atrocious” crimes he’d seen in his career as a prosecutor. He said he planned to file first-degree murder charges against Underwood on Monday and would seek the death penalty.

“This does not appear to be a spur-of-the-moment crime of opportunity but a well-thought-out, premeditated act with months of planning and preparation,” Kuykendall said.

No prior record
Tompkins said Underwood had no apparent criminal record. He also said it wasn’t known whether Underwood had a history of mental illness, but he expects mental competency to be an issue at trial.

It was not immediately known whether Underwood had a lawyer.

The manager of the apartment complex, Tim Bayer, told The Oklahoman that Underwood liked to stand outside his apartment and watch children play. He said Underwood didn’t have a car of his own and that he kept his apartment clean.

Jamie lived upstairs in an apartment with her father, Curtis Bolin, an auto mechanic, her grandmother said. Jamie’s mother, Jenny, is a truck driver in Oklahoma City. The couple separated several years ago, Fox said.

Fox said the family is distraught, especially the child’s father, who remained under sedation.

“His whole life revolved around Jamie,” Fox said. “He didn’t go out and party. He didn’t drink or smoke. This has probably destroyed him.”

This a**hole lived about 15 minutes from my father... They got the Amber alert on this girl last Wednesday. The police were led astray by the testimony of a group of 10 year olds while the killer was hacking this girl up in the same apartment complex she went missing in.

I hope the girl was dead long before anything started really awful. They said she was hit three times by a wooden cutting board. I pray that's what killed her.

TMI ALERT: In local news, the body was found in pieces, with the head mostly decapitated, raped, bludgeoned, etc. He told cops, "go search the place, I chopped her up, she's in there" He also said that he watched Spongebob with her before telling her he was going to kill her. She said she was sorry and told him she wouldn't tell anyone if he let her go. The 'motive' from the CNN article is pretty close to what had actually transpired.

I wish they'd let her dad have about 24 hours alone with this vile bastard. He's now on the edge of insanity, heavily sedated as his daughter was his whole life.

optik_nerve · 04-17-2006, 05:57 PM

Holy fucking shit. This is the most disturbing thing I've ever read in current news. It's appalling that somebody would even think about doing this to a little girl or anybody for that matter.

I would put out my opinion on what should be the punishment, but no punishment on earth is equal to the actions that have been executed in this crime.

maleficent · 04-17-2006, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Kuykendall said that Underwood said he began fantasizing about eating someone a year ago. The prosecutor added that authorities believe “that while she was ultimately chosen to be the victim of this horrific crime, that other people had been targeted and considered,” including a a woman and a 5-year-old boy.

Quote:

“This does not appear to be a spur-of-the-moment crime of opportunity but a well-thought-out, premeditated act with months of planning and preparation,” Kuykendall said.

Florida still uses the electric chair for the death penalty don't they? Nothing peaceful like lethal injection... If this guy is sane enough to stand trial, and is found guilty... the chair is really too good for him...

I really find it distasteful though, that so much detail was given to the media and printed. It's going to be tough for this guy to get a fair trial now...

Zeraph · 04-17-2006, 07:19 PM

Don't think of it as human. Anything that could do that has disassociated itself far from humanity.

djtestudo · 04-17-2006, 07:26 PM

I was discussing a different topic with my sister and brought up that stoning should be brought back as a method of execution.

This just strengthens my stand.

At least him confessing should make it a little quicker to the guerney then otherwise, hopefully.

Willravel · 04-17-2006, 07:49 PM

This man obviously suffers from a very rare kind of disorder: anthropophagal paraphilia. This man is not well, and obviosuly should be under the supervision of psychologists for the rest of his life. To execute the insane (using the term 'insane' loosely) is obviously wrong, and to imprison someone this disturbed would be VERY dangerous to other prisoners. This man is the reason there are asylums for the criminally insane.

Leaving the man aside for the moment, I can't imagine the pain of discovering a friend or loved one had been a victim of such a cruel and unnatural death. I occasionally worry that someone I know will be involved in a car accedent or maybe have cancer, but to be suffocated, raped, and then plans were made to ingest her? It's disgusting and unsettling in a way that I've n ever even considered in my worst nightmares. My thoughts and prayers are with the family and other loved ones of that poor girl. I can't begin to imagine their sorrow and shock.

Randerolf · 04-17-2006, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maleficent

Florida still uses the electric chair for the death penalty don't they? Nothing peaceful like lethal injection... If this guy is sane enough to stand trial, and is found guilty... the chair is really too good for him...

Point of Information: Ole Sparky was done away with in the late 90's. Lethal injection is now the method of choice.

analog · 04-17-2006, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindalove

I hope the girl was dead long before anything started really awful. They said she was hit three times by a wooden cutting board. I pray that's what killed her.

The article indicates she was suffocated after being beaten with the cutting board, and that's what killed her:

Quote:

...then placed his hand and duct tape over her mouth to suffocate her.

Cause of death is very important, scientifically. They can tell what killed someone, and in this case it appears to have been the suffocation.

I find it odd that the newspaper sensationalized it as much as they did, making a point of saying the body was naked when found cut up. Of course it was naked- how would a pair of shorts or a shirt stay on the body when the limbs are removed? That was just a ploy at the heart, and totally unnecessary.

willravel: I agree with you to a point, but this disorder is not something from which one can be rehabilitated. If he'd spend the rest of his life in an asylum, I say forget the tax dollars it would take and end his life now. Hospitals for the mentally ill like this guy would go to, are tremendously expensive to operate. I don't see the point in keeping around such a dangerous individual.

Willravel · 04-17-2006, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by analog

willravel: I agree with you to a point, but this disorder is not something from which one can be rehabilitated. If he'd spend the rest of his life in an asylum, I say forget the tax dollars it would take and end his life now. Hospitals for the mentally ill like this guy would go to, are tremendously expensive to operate. I don't see the point in keeping around such a dangerous individual.

I agree with you about the sensationalizing, but it's the way news operates now.

I'm sure most people know I am completly agains the death penalty, but this case didn't even make me think of that. You can't give the death penalty to children, mentally disabled or disturbed, or the terminally ill. We're better than that. This man is not simply a bad man, he is a sick man who functions in a different way than you or I. Because of that, he should not be treated like you or I.

I should also say that there is no disorder with a 100% failure rate of treatment. To state as fact that this man cannot be rehabilitated beyond a reasonable doubt is incorrect. Even if there were a 1/100,000 chance of rehabilitating this man, we should try. Even if he couldn't be healed, it's possible that in studying his disorders doctors could diagnose peopel with similar disorders with a greater efficency (which could save the next victim). I'd hate to miss the chance to save a life from torture simply out of a vendetta. Does he deserve to be punished? Almost certianally. Was what he did absolutely sickening? Absolutely. Would there be a reasonable risk of it happening again if he were in an institution for the criminally insane? No.

Halx · 04-17-2006, 08:54 PM

Now that's news!

I'm not interested in celebrities cheating on eachother.
I'm not interested in politicians testifying in perjury cases.
I'm not interested in NASCAR.

But this... this is news worthy.

feelgood · 04-17-2006, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Behavior aroused suspicion
Authorities said they became suspicious of Underwood when he pulled up to a check point set up near the apartment complex two days after the girl was reported missing.

“He was an occupant of a vehicle. He just wasn’t acting right,” said Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper Kera Philippi. “From there, they talked to him and the FBI took him into questioning.”

I wonder what constitute as "just wasn't acting right". Other than that, I agree its one fucked up crime.

Daniel_ · 04-17-2006, 11:23 PM

A society that can afford a space programme and foreign wars can afford to lock the dangerously insane away.

I personally feel that if it's wrong for a person to kill a person, it should be considered MORE wrong for the state (acting in dispassionate timely ways) to kill a person.

The problem with saying that we should execute the dangerously insane is that there will always be borderline cases. This case seems clear-cut, but how far do you take it? If we start by killing this man, how long is it before people are being killed because a little girl went missing, and they were the local "oddball". It happened in the past, after all.

Also, if we decide to kill the criminally insane, some prosecutors will be trying to argue that defendants are insane and incurable in order to get the death penalty for crimes that might not otherwise "deserve" it.

Tough call.

raeanna74 · 04-18-2006, 04:52 AM

There are times when it would be nice to be able to have lynch mobs. THIS man, is clearly guilty of premeditated crime. Anyone who commits a premeditated murder has some mental issues so insanity should not be a protection against the death penalty.

This reinforces in my mind that I'm not being overly protective by not allowing my daughter to go to anyone elses house (even to other kids houses on my block) unless I know the parents and know that the parents are home.

My daughter is very friendly to strangers and that bothers me because she's not wary enough to protect herself should she need to. Though I have seen her use her fists before so perhaps instinct would kick in and she would fight back. This story is scary for anyone and especially a parent to hear. For that father's sake I hope the trial is swift and deadly as a long drawn out trial that ends in no retribution will be pure torture for that poor man.

Jimellow · 04-18-2006, 05:07 AM

I'm curious how one can be certain this guy is suffering from a mental illness and not just be a mean bastard that enjoys killing and cutting up a little girl. What is the determining factor in whether a murderer is mentally ill or just a cold blooded and ruthless killer?

stevo · 04-18-2006, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raeanna74

There are times when it would be nice to be able to have lynch mobs.

Here Here!

This guy will get it one way or another. If he doesn't get a death sentance he'll most likely be beaten to death in jail. If by some fluke he does get namby-pambied by the justice system and sentanced to an insane asylum someone will assasinate him. Fuck compassion and remove this shit from the face of the earth. He has lost the right to being human. If he wants to act like an animal thats how he will be treated.

ps. this happened in OK, not FL. Oklahoma uses lethal injection, but authorizes electricution if lethal injection is found unconstitutional and firing squad if both lethal injection and electrocution are found unconstitutional. I vote for a few big guys wearing boots and a lead pipe.

hulk · 04-18-2006, 05:34 AM

Their lawyer. Insane is a legal term, not a medical one.

Sultana · 04-18-2006, 07:43 AM

I'm still in a bit of shock over this whole thing, but I would like to note, dispassionately and unemotionally, that I do not understand why it is even remotely a point to preserve the life of someone (anyone, really) who has so little regard for life themself.

This is an unusual case, he is clearly guilty. I cannot fathom any reason why the state should shell out the bucks to lock away and protect this person, and even pretend to try to rehabilitate them. He is a predator and needs to be dealt with accordingly.

Willravel · 04-18-2006, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimellow

I'm curious how one can be certain this guy is suffering from a mental illness and not just be a mean bastard that enjoys killing and cutting up a little girl. What is the determining factor in whether a murderer is mentally ill or just a cold blooded and ruthless killer?

You really think he did this just because he's a "mean bastard"? And what makes you think that a cold blooded killer isn't a sociopath or psychopath? Do you have a PCL-R or DSM?

Jimellow · 04-18-2006, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

You really think he did this just because he's a "mean bastard"? And what makes you think that a cold blooded killer isn't a sociopath or psychopath? Do you have a PCL-R or DSM?

I avoided taking a stance on this issue intentionally and instead asked a fair question. As for PCL-R or DSM; I have no idea what either are, which would tie into me asking my original question in the first place.

ClostGoth · 04-18-2006, 09:24 AM

My gut reaction as a parent is that he should be put down like a rabid dog. The story upset me pretty badly - why so much detail leaked to the press before the trial? I usually do not advocate for the death penalty, but am probably too upset to form an un-emotional opinion on this one. The most important point (IMHO) being that at least they caught the guy before he picked up someone else AND that he never be allowed the opportunity to do it again.

Jinn · 04-18-2006, 09:25 AM

Holy crap -- I think the creepiest part was the chief's response:

“Regarding a potential motive, this appears to have been part of a plan to kidnap a person, rape them, torture them, kill them, cut off their head, drain the body of blood, rape the corpse, eat the corpse, then dispose of the organs and bones,” the police chief said.

That's pretty brutal for a description to a news reporter, especially considering how speculative it is. Nonetheless, holy hell..

ClostGoth · 04-18-2006, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimellow

I avoided taking a stance on this issue intentionally and instead asked a fair question. As for PCL-R or DSM; I have no idea what either are, which would tie into me asking my original question in the first place.

Isn't the PCL-R a type of check-list they have for suspected sociopaths and/or psychopaths? It's kind of like the checklist they give us for new foster placements - you rate the child's behavior on a scale for each of about 70 questions and they determine if there's reason for diagnosis and further testing. I don't know if that's actually how they diagnose a psychosis or not. (Which I assume is what the DSM is for - I can't recall what the acronym stands for but I know it's a reference guide about mental illnesses.) Either way, does it really matter? Yes, something in the guy's head has to be off chemically for him to have experienced the desire to act the way he did in the first place. Apparently he'd been obsessing about it for some time. Freud would have a field day. But I think legally they have to prove he was incapable of knowing right from wrong. If they decide he lost his ability to know that what he was doing was wrong (which seems obvious to me that he did NOT because he went to lengths to hide his crime) then he's legally insane. I'm no expert, but that's my understanding. I'd welcome correction if I'm wrong, though.

Willravel · 04-18-2006, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimellow

I avoided taking a stance on this issue intentionally and instead asked a fair question. As for PCL-R or DSM; I have no idea what either are, which would tie into me asking my original question in the first place.

Misunderstood, apologies.

PCL-R = Hare Psychopathy Tests
DSM = Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mendal Disorders

My thought is that anyone who engages in anthropophagal paraphilia (sexually motivated cannibalism) is probalby pretty messed up. I would have to speak to him to be sure, but I'd bet the farm he's basically nuts.

Bill O'Rights · 04-18-2006, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

I would have to speak to him to be sure, but I'd bet the farm he's basically nuts.

You'd have to talk to him? To be sure? I'll go out on a limb here and say that there is not a shadow of a doubt that he's nuts. No remotely sane person does what he did. No one.
The question remains...should he be deprived of the balance of his life? In this case...I'd probably lean toward a yes vote. The only reason, and I do mean the only reason to keep providing him with nourishment is, as you've already pointed out...research. I only hope there is a lot of painful hole poking, of one fashion or another, in whatever studies are conducted upon him.

Ustwo · 04-18-2006, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

This man obviously suffers from a very rare kind of disorder: anthropophagal paraphilia. This man is not well, and obviosuly should be under the supervision of psychologists for the rest of his life. To execute the insane (using the term 'insane' loosely) is obviously wrong, and to imprison someone this disturbed would be VERY dangerous to other prisoners. This man is the reason there are asylums for the criminally insane.

That....

Or we could just kill him. Who cares if someone is 'insane' or not. You can argue that most violent people have some disorder making them violent. I don't care, flush them, lest they hurt anyone else.

Sugarmouse · 04-18-2006, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ustwo

That....

Or we could just kill him. Who cares if someone is 'insane' or not. You can argue that most violent people have some disorder making them violent. I don't care, flush them, lest they hurt anyone else.

what is the legal definition of insane?does it deem someoen irresponsable for their actions?! and even if it did, does this mean we should have this man, whom is obviously a danger to functional society, given a second chance?i say get rid of him ,there is no point.he is dangerous.

Willravel · 04-18-2006, 02:57 PM

So even in a locked room, in a white jacket, with no exposure to anyone or anything, this man is dangerous enough for us to kill him? Sounds like a vendetta to me.

His vicious visitation shows he is violently vicious. My suggestion to vanquish him allows for no valorous vacancy of the asylum. There he will stay vanquished without the possibility of vindication.

In all seriousness, how can anyone consider executing the criminally insane? The opportunity alone of using him to treat future cases has got to be worth sparing his life. I dispise what he did. It was an abomination and truely the definition of evil, but killing him would be wrong.

smooth · 04-18-2006, 10:22 PM

I wasn't watching the headline news lately and now my friends probably think I'm crazy. We were talking about sushi, my pet eels, and my tendency to eat eels when I go out for sushi. And then my wife started teasing me about eating my pets, to which I responded that yeah, I'd eat my pets, but that my eels were too expensive. And she said that'd be like eating our kids. To which I replied that I would eat our kid if one ever died. Get my money's worth kinda joke. My friend laughed and actually started to think about my point that after investing 10Ks of money, might as well do something...

hmm, I didn't realize how close my words were to this story, yeesh!

itch vaccine · 04-18-2006, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

So even in a locked room, in a white jacket, with no exposure to anyone or anything, this man is dangerous enough for us to kill him? Sounds like a vendetta to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

I'm sure most people know I am completly agains the death penalty, but this case didn't even make me think of that. You can't give the death penalty to children, mentally disabled or disturbed, or the terminally ill. We're better than that. This man is not simply a bad man, he is a sick man who functions in a different way than you or I. Because of that, he should not be treated like you or I.

Are you saying that because he's different, we should give him *different* punishments?

You don't think he's dangerous enough for us to kill him?

Isn't causing harm in such a way danger enough for any of us, and he.. was extremely wicked in thought with what he planned to do (or did) to that girl.

lindalove · 04-19-2006, 12:00 AM

At least he didn't get a chance to do everything he was planning on doing--she might not have ever been found in that case.

And of course, this sicko has a blog:

http://futureworldruler.blogspot.com/

And a Wish List at Amazon, which has, amongst other things, a book about cannibalism.

He had a MySpace, too, but when I checked yesterday, it was "undergoing maintenance."

This page has links to his cached myspace, yahoo page, blog, etc...

itch vaccine · 04-19-2006, 12:04 AM

What? He seems to live a perfectly normal life.

It totally baffles me. He is sick. But somehow, I feel that he should not be exempt from death penalty just because he is different in sanity.

raeanna74 · 04-19-2006, 05:34 AM

I don't see the death penalty's goal as being one of protecting society from people who are this dangerous. I see it as a PENALTY. A Punishment. He inflicted a cruel death on another innocent human being. Then proceeded to desecrate her body. His intention was to hide what he did and thus never give her loved ones closure. He deserves a death as miserable as he inflicted but the least we can do is to end his life. He serves no beneficial purpose in maintaining his life. He will drain money from the system that could be used to rehabilitate USEFUL members of society. He will drain rescources that could be used to help others who are truely needy. He will still have some contact with Dr's and personel who care for him and keep him confined. This ongoing human contact poses a small danger even still that he could/would harm another person if he get the chance. His actions result in nullifying any rightful claim that he ever held on life. The fact that he hid his actions simply shows that he KNEW there would be repercusions for what he'd done.

aKula · 04-19-2006, 05:58 AM

I think any money spent on keeping him locked up is worth it not to have to execute someone. Again it's not a question of danger, if you lock him up for life he won't really have much of a chance of doing something like this again. I think it boils down to what raenna was saying. Either you execute someone as punishment (and maybe to save some money) or you are opposed to such measures and believe someone who committed such a crime should be locked up.
Also I agree with BOR that someone who did such a thing must be insane. But that's not the reason I don't think he should be executed. I am opposed to the death penalty no matter what the crime is. Revenge for society's sake seems rather superfluous to me. I can see why the victim's family would call for the death penalty but I don't think it should be used.

itch vaccine · 04-19-2006, 06:09 AM

aKula : Do you really think someone who has comitted such a wicked act is worth to be kept around, being monitored in an asylum? And what do we plan to achieve with monitoring him?

Even if he does have a chance to recover for the better,
Would you have it in yourself to let him free?

stevo · 04-19-2006, 06:51 AM

Where's Jack Ruby when you need him?

Willravel · 04-19-2006, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by itch vaccine

Are you saying that because he's different, we should give him *different* punishments?

Would you sentence a kid with down syndrome or mental retardation to death? How about a minor?

Quote:

Originally Posted by itch vaccine

You don't think he's dangerous enough for us to kill him?

Already answered this one:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

So even in a locked room, in a white jacket, with no exposure to anyone or anything, this man is dangerous enough for us to kill him?

He couldn't possibly constitute a future threat to society unless the law assumes prison breaks. If he can't get out, he's obviously not going to kill again. So assuming that, why sentence him to death? Simple. He's bad and needs to die. Remember when I said "vendetta"? Blood for blood. Sounds like vengence to me, and this man is in the hands of the justice system now, not the vengence system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by itch vaccine

Do you really think someone who has comitted such a wicked act is worth to be kept around, being monitored in an asylum? And what do we plan to achieve with monitoring him?

What do we plan to acheive? I don't mean to sound condecending, but have you ever worked in an asylum? Do you hold a degree in psychology, psychotherapy, or psychiatry? Do you have any experience in dealing with mental illness such as this man has?

Quote:

Originally Posted by itch vaccine

Even if he does have a chance to recover for the better, Would you have it in yourself to let him free?

Again, this reasoning screams vengence. So even if, after years of intense therepy, this man regains his sanity, we shouldn't even consider letting him free?

stevo · 04-19-2006, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

Would you sentence a kid with down syndrome or mental retardation to death? How about a minor?

Underwood does not have down syndrome, nor is he retarded, nor is he a minor.

Quote:

He couldn't possibly constitute a future threat to society unless the law assumes prison breaks. If he can't get out, he's obviously not going to kill again. So assuming that, why sentence him to death? Simple. He's bad and needs to die. Remember when I said "vendetta"? Blood for blood. Sounds like vengence to me, and this man is in the hands of the justice system now, not the vengence system.

And it is a death penalty. like raeanna said, its a penalty for a reason. Thats the law in OK. The penalty for capital murder is death.

Quote:

Again, this reasoning screams vengence. So even if, after years of intense therepy, this man regains his sanity, we shouldn't even consider letting him free?

No. I can't even believe people are even considering not killing him.

Willravel · 04-19-2006, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevo

Underwood does not have down syndrome, nor is he retarded, nor is he a minor.

Underwood is insane. How is killing someone who is insane any different than killing someone who is mentally disabled? Bear in mind that the Supreme Court ruled that it is a violation of the ban on cruel unusual punishment to execute death row inmates who have mental retardation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevo

And it is a death penalty. like raeanna said, its a penalty for a reason. Thats the law in OK. The penalty for capital murder is death.

Actually, it's first-degree murder in conjunction with a finding of at least 1 of 8 statutorily defined aggravating circumstances.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevo

No. I can't even believe people are even considering not killing him.

Why?

Ustwo · 04-19-2006, 08:28 AM

Same planet, different worlds.

In my world, you kill someones child, cut up that child, and try to eat them, you die. You don't get therapy, I don't care what your motivation was, I don't care if some PhD student wants to make you her rehabilitation case for her disertation, your life is over. No second chance.

stevo · 04-19-2006, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

Underwood is insane. How is killing someone who is insane any different than killing someone who is mentally disabled? Bear in mind that the Supreme Court ruled that it is a violation of the ban on cruel unusual punishment to execute death row inmates who have mental retardation.

Actually, it's first-degree murder in conjunction with a finding of at least 1 of 8 statutorily defined aggravating circumstances.

Why?

I'll just direct you back to Ustwo's post. Up there ^

04-17-2006, 07:26 PM	#5 (permalink)
djtestudo Baltimoron Location: Beeeeeautiful Bel Air, MD	I was discussing a different topic with my sister and brought up that stoning should be brought back as a method of execution. This just strengthens my stand. At least him confessing should make it a little quicker to the guerney then otherwise, hopefully. __________________ "Final thought: I just rented Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. Frankly, it was the worst sports movie I've ever seen." --Peter Schmuck, The (Baltimore) Sun

04-17-2006, 08:54 PM	#10 (permalink)
Halx Please touch this. Owner/Admin Location: Manhattan	Now that's news! I'm not interested in celebrities cheating on eachother. I'm not interested in politicians testifying in perjury cases. I'm not interested in NASCAR. But this... this is news worthy. __________________ You have found this post informative. -The Administrator [Don't Feed The Animals]

04-17-2006, 11:23 PM	#12 (permalink)
Daniel_ Evil Priest: The Devil Made Me Do It! Location: Southern England	A society that can afford a space programme and foreign wars can afford to lock the dangerously insane away. I personally feel that if it's wrong for a person to kill a person, it should be considered MORE wrong for the state (acting in dispassionate timely ways) to kill a person. The problem with saying that we should execute the dangerously insane is that there will always be borderline cases. This case seems clear-cut, but how far do you take it? If we start by killing this man, how long is it before people are being killed because a little girl went missing, and they were the local "oddball". It happened in the past, after all. Also, if we decide to kill the criminally insane, some prosecutors will be trying to argue that defendants are insane and incurable in order to get the death penalty for crimes that might not otherwise "deserve" it. Tough call. __________________ ╔═════════════════════════════════════════╗ Overhead, the Albatross hangs motionless upon the air, And deep beneath the rolling waves, In labyrinths of Coral Caves, The Echo of a distant time Comes willowing across the sand; And everthing is Green and Submarine ╚═════════════════════════════════════════╝

04-18-2006, 04:52 AM	#13 (permalink)
raeanna74 I'm not a blonde! I'm knot! I'm knot! I'm knot! Location: Upper Michigan	There are times when it would be nice to be able to have lynch mobs. THIS man, is clearly guilty of premeditated crime. Anyone who commits a premeditated murder has some mental issues so insanity should not be a protection against the death penalty. This reinforces in my mind that I'm not being overly protective by not allowing my daughter to go to anyone elses house (even to other kids houses on my block) unless I know the parents and know that the parents are home. My daughter is very friendly to strangers and that bothers me because she's not wary enough to protect herself should she need to. Though I have seen her use her fists before so perhaps instinct would kick in and she would fight back. This story is scary for anyone and especially a parent to hear. For that father's sake I hope the trial is swift and deadly as a long drawn out trial that ends in no retribution will be pure torture for that poor man. __________________ "Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

04-18-2006, 05:07 AM	#14 (permalink)
Jimellow Junkie	I'm curious how one can be certain this guy is suffering from a mental illness and not just be a mean bastard that enjoys killing and cutting up a little girl. What is the determining factor in whether a murderer is mentally ill or just a cold blooded and ruthless killer? __________________ Desperation is no excuse for lowering one's standards.

04-17-2006, 05:57 PM	#2 (permalink)
optik_nerve Psycho Location: Florida	Holy fucking shit. This is the most disturbing thing I've ever read in current news. It's appalling that somebody would even think about doing this to a little girl or anybody for that matter. I would put out my opinion on what should be the punishment, but no punishment on earth is equal to the actions that have been executed in this crime.

04-17-2006, 07:19 PM	#4 (permalink)
Zeraph Banned Location: The Cosmos	Don't think of it as human. Anything that could do that has disassociated itself far from humanity.

04-17-2006, 07:49 PM	#6 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	This man obviously suffers from a very rare kind of disorder: anthropophagal paraphilia. This man is not well, and obviosuly should be under the supervision of psychologists for the rest of his life. To execute the insane (using the term 'insane' loosely) is obviously wrong, and to imprison someone this disturbed would be VERY dangerous to other prisoners. This man is the reason there are asylums for the criminally insane. Leaving the man aside for the moment, I can't imagine the pain of discovering a friend or loved one had been a victim of such a cruel and unnatural death. I occasionally worry that someone I know will be involved in a car accedent or maybe have cancer, but to be suffocated, raped, and then plans were made to ingest her? It's disgusting and unsettling in a way that I've n ever even considered in my worst nightmares. My thoughts and prayers are with the family and other loved ones of that poor girl. I can't begin to imagine their sorrow and shock.

04-18-2006, 05:34 AM	#16 (permalink)
hulk C'mon, just blow it. Location: Perth, Australia	Their lawyer. Insane is a legal term, not a medical one. __________________ "'There's a tendency among the press to attribute the creation of a game to a single person,' says Warren Spector, creator of Thief and Deus Ex." -- From an IGN game review.

04-18-2006, 07:43 AM	#17 (permalink)
Sultana Falling Angel Location: L.A. L.A. land	I'm still in a bit of shock over this whole thing, but I would like to note, dispassionately and unemotionally, that I do not understand why it is even remotely a point to preserve the life of someone (anyone, really) who has so little regard for life themself. This is an unusual case, he is clearly guilty. I cannot fathom any reason why the state should shell out the bucks to lock away and protect this person, and even pretend to try to rehabilitate them. He is a predator and needs to be dealt with accordingly. __________________ "Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come." - Matt Groening My goal? To fulfill my potential.

04-18-2006, 09:24 AM	#20 (permalink)
ClostGoth Crazy Location: Omaha, NE	My gut reaction as a parent is that he should be put down like a rabid dog. The story upset me pretty badly - why so much detail leaked to the press before the trial? I usually do not advocate for the death penalty, but am probably too upset to form an un-emotional opinion on this one. The most important point (IMHO) being that at least they caught the guy before he picked up someone else AND that he never be allowed the opportunity to do it again. __________________ I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I intended to be. --Douglas Adams

04-18-2006, 09:25 AM	#21 (permalink)
Jinn Lover - Protector - Teacher Location: Seattle, WA	Holy crap -- I think the creepiest part was the chief's response: “Regarding a potential motive, this appears to have been part of a plan to kidnap a person, rape them, torture them, kill them, cut off their head, drain the body of blood, rape the corpse, eat the corpse, then dispose of the organs and bones,” the police chief said. That's pretty brutal for a description to a news reporter, especially considering how speculative it is. Nonetheless, holy hell.. __________________ "I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

04-18-2006, 02:57 PM	#27 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	So even in a locked room, in a white jacket, with no exposure to anyone or anything, this man is dangerous enough for us to kill him? Sounds like a vendetta to me. His vicious visitation shows he is violently vicious. My suggestion to vanquish him allows for no valorous vacancy of the asylum. There he will stay vanquished without the possibility of vindication. In all seriousness, how can anyone consider executing the criminally insane? The opportunity alone of using him to treat future cases has got to be worth sparing his life. I dispise what he did. It was an abomination and truely the definition of evil, but killing him would be wrong.

04-18-2006, 10:22 PM	#28 (permalink)
smooth Junkie Location: Right here	I wasn't watching the headline news lately and now my friends probably think I'm crazy. We were talking about sushi, my pet eels, and my tendency to eat eels when I go out for sushi. And then my wife started teasing me about eating my pets, to which I responded that yeah, I'd eat my pets, but that my eels were too expensive. And she said that'd be like eating our kids. To which I replied that I would eat our kid if one ever died. Get my money's worth kinda joke. My friend laughed and actually started to think about my point that after investing 10Ks of money, might as well do something... hmm, I didn't realize how close my words were to this story, yeesh! __________________ "The theory of a free press is that truth will emerge from free discussion, not that it will be presented perfectly and instantly in any one account." -- Walter Lippmann "You measure democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists." -- Abbie Hoffman

04-19-2006, 12:00 AM	#30 (permalink)
lindalove Registered User	At least he didn't get a chance to do everything he was planning on doing--she might not have ever been found in that case. And of course, this sicko has a blog: http://futureworldruler.blogspot.com/ And a Wish List at Amazon, which has, amongst other things, a book about cannibalism. He had a MySpace, too, but when I checked yesterday, it was "undergoing maintenance." This page has links to his cached myspace, yahoo page, blog, etc...

04-19-2006, 12:04 AM	#31 (permalink)
itch vaccine Psycho Location: on my spinning computer chair	What? He seems to live a perfectly normal life. It totally baffles me. He is sick. But somehow, I feel that he should not be exempt from death penalty just because he is different in sanity. __________________ "When you sit with a nice girl for two hours, it seems like two minutes. When you sit on a hot stove for two minutes, it seems like two hours. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein

04-19-2006, 05:34 AM	#32 (permalink)
raeanna74 I'm not a blonde! I'm knot! I'm knot! I'm knot! Location: Upper Michigan	I don't see the death penalty's goal as being one of protecting society from people who are this dangerous. I see it as a PENALTY. A Punishment. He inflicted a cruel death on another innocent human being. Then proceeded to desecrate her body. His intention was to hide what he did and thus never give her loved ones closure. He deserves a death as miserable as he inflicted but the least we can do is to end his life. He serves no beneficial purpose in maintaining his life. He will drain money from the system that could be used to rehabilitate USEFUL members of society. He will drain rescources that could be used to help others who are truely needy. He will still have some contact with Dr's and personel who care for him and keep him confined. This ongoing human contact poses a small danger even still that he could/would harm another person if he get the chance. His actions result in nullifying any rightful claim that he ever held on life. The fact that he hid his actions simply shows that he KNEW there would be repercusions for what he'd done. __________________ "Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

04-19-2006, 05:58 AM	#33 (permalink)
aKula Psycho	I think any money spent on keeping him locked up is worth it not to have to execute someone. Again it's not a question of danger, if you lock him up for life he won't really have much of a chance of doing something like this again. I think it boils down to what raenna was saying. Either you execute someone as punishment (and maybe to save some money) or you are opposed to such measures and believe someone who committed such a crime should be locked up. Also I agree with BOR that someone who did such a thing must be insane. But that's not the reason I don't think he should be executed. I am opposed to the death penalty no matter what the crime is. Revenge for society's sake seems rather superfluous to me. I can see why the victim's family would call for the death penalty but I don't think it should be used. __________________ "I am the wrath of God. The earth I pass will see me and tremble." -Klaus Kinski as Don Lope de Aguirre

04-19-2006, 06:09 AM	#34 (permalink)
itch vaccine Psycho Location: on my spinning computer chair	aKula : Do you really think someone who has comitted such a wicked act is worth to be kept around, being monitored in an asylum? And what do we plan to achieve with monitoring him? Even if he does have a chance to recover for the better, Would you have it in yourself to let him free? __________________ "When you sit with a nice girl for two hours, it seems like two minutes. When you sit on a hot stove for two minutes, it seems like two hours. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein Last edited by itch vaccine; 04-19-2006 at 06:12 AM..

04-19-2006, 06:51 AM	#35 (permalink)
stevo Rail Baron Location: Tallyfla	Where's Jack Ruby when you need him? __________________ "If I am such a genius why am I drunk, lost in the desert, with a bullet in my ass?" -Otto Mannkusser

04-19-2006, 08:28 AM	#39 (permalink)
Ustwo Pissing in the cornflakes	Same planet, different worlds. In my world, you kill someones child, cut up that child, and try to eat them, you die. You don't get therapy, I don't care what your motivation was, I don't care if some PhD student wants to make you her rehabilitation case for her disertation, your life is over. No second chance. __________________ Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.