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Old 05-12-2008, 08:34 AM   #1 (permalink)
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From Russia With Hate

Quote:
Current's Christof Putzel investigates a growing movement in Russia where neo-Nazi groups are brutally attacking immigrants and spreading their hate by posting violent videos online.

Quite an interesting (albeit sad) video. It's like American History X, but very.. very.. real. I can't really think of what else to add, other than I think it's worth talking about this, because I had no idea Russia had such a big (and growing) problem before I watched this video.

It seems like this will inevitably happen anywhere that xenophobia is allowed to propagate, and anywhere where you find disenchanted poor people who believe immigrants are the reason they can't find and maintain steady employment.

As a matter or fact, I wouldn't be surprised to find this thing springing up closer to home, where poor white people with no job skills start blaming "Mexicans" for taking all their jobs, when in reality it's their inability to educate themselves and become valuable employees that is the direct cause. Texas, for one, springs to mind.
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Last edited by Jinn; 05-12-2008 at 08:38 AM..
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:23 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Right here in London, a member of the BNP (British National Party) recently won a seat in the London Assembly for the first time. They are openly against immigration and immigrants and I can't help but wonder if we are headed down the same route.
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:34 AM   #3 (permalink)
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We liberals just need to work harder. More empathy emotion management and problem solving, multiculturalism, and equality training in schools.
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:45 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
More empathy emotion management and problem solving, multiculturalism, and equality training in schools.
Uh-huh. How about a little more time on reading skills, math, science...English, for crying out loud? Too much time is already being spent on this "feel good" crap, that students graduate high school without being able to constuct a simple sentence. But....that's really not what this thread is about..is it?
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:48 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill O'Rights
Uh-huh. How about a little more time on reading skills, math, science...English, for crying out loud? Too much time is already being spent on this "feel good" crap, that students graduate high school without being able to constuct a simple sentence. But....that's really not what this thread is about..is it?
I agree.. "emotion management" is not something schools should be teaching.


I also agree it has very little to do with the topic.
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:58 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill O'Rights
Uh-huh. How about a little more time on reading skills, math, science...English, for crying out loud?
You want more than 6 hours a day? All students do is useless english math and science that most will never use.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill O'Rights
Too much time is already being spent on this "feel good" crap, that students graduate high school without being able to constuct a simple sentence. But....that's really not what this thread is about..is it?
This "feel good crap" has an established causal relationship with lower instances of crime, lower abuse rates, and lower drop-out rates. The thread is about Neo-Nazi groups, which can be stopped before they start by simply giving children the emotional and intellectual technologies they need to move away from hate and ignorance. The problem is that schools are standardized test-oriented instead of being oriented to helping children develop into adults.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:27 AM   #7 (permalink)
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oh wow this thread is going to fracture in to an education debate real fast.

But both sides are right, theres no reason to sacrifice one at the expense of the other.

Obviously we're all literate and educated enough to form legible sentences and discuss topics on this forum. LIEZX OMZ HAZ YU HERD THE NEW MANSON ALBUM!#$@# <--- what's coming out of schools today.

I was saved by the graces of home schooling and learned the majority of my reading/writing/arithmetic during my 6th/7th grade years before I went back to public school. The fact is, if you slip through the cracks, and the teachers don't care to notice, no one will help educate you except your parents, that is, if they care to, have time to.

I think I lucked out. I was pretty close to becoming yet another undereducated product of the public schooling system, now that I look back on it.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:34 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
We liberals just need to work harder. More empathy emotion management and problem solving, multiculturalism, and equality training in schools.


So what exactly is 'equality training'?

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/K28f0bxBVsA&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/K28f0bxBVsA&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

The fact its not in English makes it even better for some reason.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:37 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ustwo
So what exactly is 'equality training'?
That's for the teachers.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:45 AM   #10 (permalink)
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i had a russian roommate for nearly 2 months and everything she said about russia was pretty fucked up. and she openly said that in moscow everything is wrong and its an incredibly unsafe place to be. shes quite small but very cute so she almost never went out after dark and even during the day would keep a constant eye on her back. she told me horror story after horror story of so mny of her friends being beaten and/or raped with absolutely no provocation.
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Old 05-12-2008, 03:13 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Overpopulation without growth causes problems. Immigration is another form of population increase. It benefits the rich though, so it is allowed to continue. Less property on the market, lower wages for labor and a more desperate workforce all work for them.

And it would be a good thing if they were able to work on improving their own home country.
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Old 05-12-2008, 03:22 PM   #12 (permalink)
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how do you define overpopulation?
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mother nature made the aeroplane, and the submarine sandwich, with the steady hands and dead eye of a remarkable sculptor.
she shed her mountain turning training wheels, for the convenience of the moving sidewalk, that delivers the magnetic monkey children through the mouth of impossible calendar clock, into the devil's manhole cauldron.
physics of a bicycle, isn't it remarkable?
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Old 05-12-2008, 03:58 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
You want more than 6 hours a day? All students do is useless english math and science that most will never use.
Huh? Useless math and science?

Quote:
This "feel good crap" has an established causal relationship with lower instances of crime, lower abuse rates, and lower drop-out rates.
Do you have a reference? Is the effect larger on "hate" really that large? I would expect that proper education and job training might have a bigger effect on hostility toward immigrants than any sensitivity training.

Quote:
The problem is that schools are standardized test-oriented instead of being oriented to helping children develop into adults.
I like standardized testing generally, but I agree that there is too great a focus on teaching to the test and not enough focus on teaching skills that students can actually use later in life.

Last edited by sapiens; 05-12-2008 at 04:05 PM..
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Old 05-12-2008, 04:01 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
You want more than 6 hours a day? All students do is useless english math and science that most will never use.
are you serious?
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Old 05-12-2008, 05:46 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sapiens
Huh? Useless math and science?
These things are useless if you're unable to function as a healthy human being. I don't mean they are useless in general. I love science and don't hate math.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapiens
Do you have a reference? Is the effect larger on "hate" really that large? I would expect that proper education and job training might have a bigger effect on hostility toward immigrants than any sensitivity training.
All of my references on Second Step are offline.
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Old 05-12-2008, 06:09 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
These things are useless if you're unable to function as a healthy human being. I don't mean they are useless in general. I love science and don't hate math.
I think that education in math, science, english, etc. helps people to function as health human beings.
Quote:
All of my references on Second Step are offline.
I don't need a link. I'm just interested in a properly cited source.
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Old 05-12-2008, 06:23 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sapiens
I think that education in math, science, english, etc. helps people to function as health human beings.
I want you to really consider each of these as a part of the whole of human development, though.
Person A: Poor at writing skills.
Person B: Hates math.
Person C: Can't empathize and thus has trouble maintaining friendships.
Who here is an unhealthy human being?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapiens
I don't need a link. I'm just interested in a properly cited source.
I'l see if I can dig it up. I'll scan it or something.
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