Boy, 12, pays child support - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

sixate · 05-03-2003, 06:39 PM

LINKY

Quote:

Boy, 12, pays child support
02 May 2003
By LEAH HAINES and GORDON JON THOMPSON

Twenty-eight boys aged between 13 and 15 who have fathered children are being forced to pay child support – the tax department will even seize the money from their paper round.

Inland Revenue confirmed a father's age was irrelevant when it demanded child support contributions.

And The Dominion Post has learned of child support being demanded of a 12-year-old for a baby born to an 18-year-old woman.

Under the Crimes Act a 12-year-old girl could be considered a victim of a sexual crime if an 18-year-old man had sex with her.

But sex between women and children is not prohibited – as The Dominion Post highlighted in the case of a female swimming coach who had sex with a 13-year-old swimming champion.

In fact, a boy who got a woman pregnant could be hit with heavy penalties if he did not make arrangements to pay support for their baby, IRD child support manager David Udy confirmed.

Any unapproved debt would accrue 2 per cent penalties each month till the boy started earning and money could be taken from him.

"The child might have an income from delivering pamphlets, for instance. It would be possible for Inland Revenue to take that income if they did not voluntarily contribute," Mr Udy said.

Justice Minister Phil Goff has said the Crimes Act could be changed by the end of the year to prohibit sex between women and children. A spokesman said Mr Goff could then look at other laws such as for child support.

Family law expert and Otago University dean of law Mark Henegan said it would probably then exempt boys from paying if they had been deemed sex-crime victims.

Till then, the act "goes a little bit against the principles of child law" which generally held that a child had to understand the implications of his actions before he was responsible for them, he said.

Several family lawyers spoken to said they had never encountered cases of such young fathers being asked for child support.

However children's commissioner advocate Trish Grant said the office was contacted by the family of a 12-year-old Napier boy in 2000 who the IRD wanted to pay child support to an 18-year-old woman.

Advocates had met with the IRD and the boy's extremely upset family, but the boy was made to pay.

The office "absolutely maintained" that children had the right to be financially supported by their parents, whether the parents played a part in their life or not, Ms Grant said.

But the personal circumstances of very young parents should also be considered.

"The situation might preclude them from getting involved in studies, for example . . . They have a right to a childhood and adolescence, and they should be held accountable. But to what degree needs to be based on what their future path might be," she said.

Unless they had considerable savings, most of the very young fathers were unlikely to be paying more than $13 a week – the minimum IRD required of liable parents, Mr Udy said.

The responsibility for the payments was theirs, not their parents.

The only exemptions were for children born out of illegal relationships such as rape and incest – in such cases the mother was not obliged to name the father for income support purposes.

And liable parents were not obliged to support their children when in prison or in long-term hospital care.

About 250,000 non-custodial parents pay child support. Eleven of them are 16, 50 are 17, the majority are aged between 35 and 45 and the oldest liable parent is 70.

BBtB · 05-03-2003, 06:44 PM

Of course the whole article does not mention the nature of the child getting the girl pregnant. I mean he could have easily been raped but at the same time it could have been consenul. If that is the case I would have no problem with them forcing his parents to pay child support untill he was older (atleast 16) Past that it is just riduclas

oane · 05-03-2003, 07:28 PM

Urm, shouldn't sexual act with a 12 year boy (by females) be considered illegal?

Fallon · 05-03-2003, 07:45 PM

That is just wrong, I mean, the kid is twelve. He should be out playing games with his friends, not making babies. Geesh, and I felt bad losing my virginity at 15...

silenced · 05-03-2003, 08:24 PM

thats unfair if its illegal for an 18 year old male to sleep with an <18 year old girl, but its legal for an 18 year old female to sleep with a <18 year old male, couldn't we claim that sexist either way 12 is too young to have sex and parents should be able to claim statutory rape for the son.

redrum · 05-03-2003, 08:47 PM

a lot of laws are not fair

still have to follow them ;/

troit · 05-03-2003, 09:15 PM

you would like that common sense would kick in with the policymakers...

Sparky · 05-03-2003, 10:09 PM

That's just sad, when the kid (father) is 20, his kid will be 8 years old.

Phaenx · 05-03-2003, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oane
Urm, shouldn't sexual act with a 12 year boy (by females) be considered illegal?

[size=large]YES![/size]

What is up with this stuff? This is a bit of a double standard. <-Understatement

dragon2fire · 05-03-2003, 10:42 PM

when i read the title of this therd i said to myself your kiding

i also thought ok i must be in the nonsense fourm cause there is no way

that is very insane

MSD · 05-03-2003, 11:10 PM

In CT, a woman having sex with an underage boy is "Influencing a minor," and although she could be charged with unlawfuil carnal knowledge of a minor, it doesn't happen. Only rarely is even the first law applied.

Ashton · 05-04-2003, 01:35 AM

Hmmmmm, I feel that anyone old enough to father a child should take responsibilty for that childs well being.... but instead of taking his paper route money the state should foot the child support until he is old enough to have a regular job and then garnish his wages and tax returns, It may seem a bit harsh but how else are these young people to learn that you can't just get girls/women pregnant without any consequences?

Dragonlich · 05-04-2003, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ashton
... It may seem a bit harsh but how else are these young people to learn that you can't just get girls/women pregnant without any consequences?

Well, that would be a logical response, but... the kid already knocked up a woman. What would be the point in him learning about the consequences *after the act*???

Cynthetiq · 05-04-2003, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dragonlich
Well, that would be a logical response, but... the kid already knocked up a woman. What would be the point in him learning about the consequences *after the act*???

isn't that by definition when you do learn from consequences? Education and public service announcements can only take you so far...

sixate · 05-04-2003, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
What is up with this stuff? This is a bit of a double standard. <-Understatement

That's pretty much how I feel about it. If an 18 year old man fucked a 12 year old girl and got her pregnant we would all want the pile of shit dead. So why is it that when an 18 year old woman gets pregnant from a 12 year old boy people want him to pay child support? Don't you all think that the woman seduced the boy and took advantage of him? The article said that sex between women and children is not prohibited. Someone try telling me this is not a double standard. This story fucking pissed me off last night. The guy/boys always get the shit end of the stick from the law.

Infinite Hybrid · 05-04-2003, 09:11 AM

I still don't understand how a 12 year old got a 18 year old women pregnant. I mean wtf?

sexylady · 05-04-2003, 09:24 AM

i was under the impression that sex with a minor (regardless of the sex of the minor) was illegal... wouldn't it be considered statutory rape regardless of the circumstances.... i know in Canada women who have sex with boys who are minors get thrown in jail... there's a teacher who had sex with one of her students when he was 12 or something and she is in prison... the boy loves her and fathered her child but she is still in jail....

BBtB · 05-04-2003, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Infinite Hybrid
I still don't understand how a 12 year old got a 18 year old women pregnant. I mean wtf?

Well when a man and a woman love each other very very much.....

Quote:

Originally posted by sexylady
i was under the impression that sex with a minor (regardless of the sex of the minor) was illegal... wouldn't it be considered statutory rape regardless of the circumstances.... i know in Canada women who have sex with boys who are minors get thrown in jail... there's a teacher who had sex with one of her students when he was 12 or something and she is in prison... the boy loves her and fathered her child but she is still in jail....

That is true in canada, and the US as well. Although the laws are still ALOT more lax towards the women having sex with the boy. I remember that teacher in florida.... At any rate this happened in New Zealand. Their just CRAZY. Or something.

Lebell · 05-04-2003, 11:34 AM

This is just one of those stories that makes me shake my head and wonder about the f***ed up world we live in.

12 yr old boy + 18 yr old woman == OK

12 yr old female + 18 yr old man != OK

:/

crypt hound · 05-04-2003, 12:34 PM

I think this law situation is because of the long-held (and erroneous) belief that women are the sexually attractive ones, men are the sexually active ones. Therefore the "weaker", more disinterested should be protected. Of course, any girl knows we're just as sexual as men, it's society that has always cast us as sexually meek and we need to comply in order to avoid being labeled "slutty". As for how this applies here, I don't believe this law is fair to men or women.

phoenix1002 · 05-04-2003, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate
The guy/boys always get the shit end of the stick from the law.

I have to agree with sixate on this one... it really does seem like the guys always get shafted by the law. I think it has a lot to do with what crypt hound was saying, about perceived gender roles. Please don't take this the wrong way-I really think men and women should be equal in the eyes of the law, I just think sometimes they take it too far to try and 'equalize' things.

Also, this is just screwed up... a 12 year old and an 18 year old? I just don't want to think about that...

BBtB · 05-04-2003, 01:16 PM

What if the woman was 40? The law would be the same but I am sure then there would be a public outcry

annie1 · 05-04-2003, 03:04 PM

oh my gosh, what an interesting story!

nefarious · 05-04-2003, 11:39 PM

wow .. every time you think the law is fucked up.. you read something else..

there are two people in those instances who are fucked up:

1. The 18 year old taking the money from a 12 year old ..
2. The law for allowing that to happen..

no wonder those christian groups say the end is nigh.. :]

sivo · 05-05-2003, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexylady
i was under the impression that sex with a minor (regardless of the sex of the minor) was illegal... wouldn't it be considered statutory rape regardless of the circumstances.... i know in Canada women who have sex with boys who are minors get thrown in jail... there's a teacher who had sex with one of her students when he was 12 or something and she is in prison... the boy loves her and fathered her child but she is still in jail....

Not here in New Zealand. As I understand it, it is part of a (n outdated) belief that women cannot possibly commit sexual offenses. These recent cases have brought to light an inadequacy in the law and it is being changed. (as was noted in the article)

MrFlux · 05-05-2003, 03:06 AM

It's just our politicians that are crazy, but as far as I know that's true for every other country as well

yabobo · 05-05-2003, 03:48 AM

Not trying to be too funny here

When I was 12 if an eighteen year old girl that I liked would even hug me. I would have shot in my jeans.

What could this girl even be thinking? Maybe it was a hug in the water or something and the little guys just swam over.

If not the little ladie needs some jail time.

pazza · 05-05-2003, 03:51 AM

That is really messed up. And besides, how did a 12 year old boy even get with an eigteen year old

hrdwareguy · 05-05-2003, 06:45 AM

Man...at least she should have known better. Maybe she figured, he's 12, I won't get pregnant from him. *shrug*

Guess it takes all kinds.

wraithhibn · 05-05-2003, 07:10 AM

it is a load of shit. she should be registered a sex offender, because young minds are impressionable, and now shes fucked this kid up.

snowace56 · 05-05-2003, 10:14 AM

well duh...it is illegal. but he got what he deserved. I don't feel sorry for anyone who gets in a position like that. He should have used protection, or better yet NOT SLEEPING WITH 18 YR OLDS!!! This world is going stright to hell!

SeXuaLSoYBeaN · 05-05-2003, 05:05 PM

Haha, sux for those underage boys!

ICER · 05-05-2003, 05:11 PM

You have to ask yourself how this boy got the girl pregant to begin with. How does a young boy at that age have sex often enough to do it (I know one time well do, But in reality. It usally takes more then that) Just goes to show you that one bad decsion can really haunt you

dolemite175 · 05-05-2003, 05:30 PM

How can that be true? I thought the law stated that it was illegal to have sex with minors regardless of what sex you are. Isn't that what they charged that female teacher with?

TrollInvestigtr · 05-05-2003, 06:32 PM

jesus christ i couldnt even shoot a wad until i was 15. forget about getting a female to actually commit sex acts with me. sheesh.

Frosstbyte · 05-05-2003, 06:41 PM

:gawks:: That's crazy. Everyone's already said everything that I would've said about double standards and just weird shit going on. Really really fucked up that kids that young have to deal with that.

floatie · 05-05-2003, 07:19 PM

Well, here's my "This is so fucked up" replic.
And I just started to think that NZ was a nice place and all, kinda like Canada only warmer...

BBtB · 05-05-2003, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dolemite175
How can that be true? I thought the law stated that it was illegal to have sex with minors regardless of what sex you are. Isn't that what they charged that female teacher with?

The teacher thing happened in florida (unless you mean some other teacher..) this happened in new zealand. Differn't laws. Has anyone seen any follow up articles? We can't be the only people on this planet that finds this ridiculous.

Gortexfogg · 05-05-2003, 08:13 PM

This is the lamest example of "justice" ever. 18yr old woman (we say 'woman' but she's probably no more mature than a kid) with a 12yr old boy. That 18yr must have been pretty desperate for sex or just plain stupid (or both).

jmf1234 · 05-05-2003, 08:25 PM

you really have to feel sorry for this kid. Instead of playing video games with his friends his paying child support this is fucking sexist

05-03-2003, 06:44 PM	#2 (permalink)
BBtB ClerkMan! Location: Tulsa, Ok.	Of course the whole article does not mention the nature of the child getting the girl pregnant. I mean he could have easily been raped but at the same time it could have been consenul. If that is the case I would have no problem with them forcing his parents to pay child support untill he was older (atleast 16) Past that it is just riduclas __________________ Meridae'n once played "death" at a game of chess that lasted for over two years. He finally beat death in a best 34 out of 67 match. At that time he could ask for any one thing and he could wish for the hope of all mankind... he looked death right in the eye and said ... "I would like about three fiddy"

05-03-2003, 07:28 PM	#3 (permalink)
oane Insane	Urm, shouldn't sexual act with a 12 year boy (by females) be considered illegal? __________________ Make me Mad. Make me Sad. Make me feel Alright.

05-03-2003, 08:24 PM	#5 (permalink)
silenced Crazy Location: Upstate NY	thats unfair if its illegal for an 18 year old male to sleep with an <18 year old girl, but its legal for an 18 year old female to sleep with a <18 year old male, couldn't we claim that sexist either way 12 is too young to have sex and parents should be able to claim statutory rape for the son. __________________ I am jack's broken heart

05-03-2003, 08:47 PM	#6 (permalink)
redrum Crazy	a lot of laws are not fair still have to follow them ;/ __________________ "you say erb....we say herb.....because theres a fucking H in it"

05-03-2003, 09:15 PM	#7 (permalink)
troit Transfer Agent Location: NYC	you would like that common sense would kick in with the policymakers... __________________ I've yet to dephile myself...

05-03-2003, 07:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Fallon Junkie Location: RI	That is just wrong, I mean, the kid is twelve. He should be out playing games with his friends, not making babies. Geesh, and I felt bad losing my virginity at 15...

05-03-2003, 10:09 PM	#8 (permalink)
Sparky Crazy	That's just sad, when the kid (father) is 20, his kid will be 8 years old. __________________ "I had never really thought about it before," Det. Dern said. "But obviously, giving an elephant an enema can be a very dangerous activity and not something that should be attempted alone."

05-03-2003, 10:42 PM	#10 (permalink)
dragon2fire Junkie	when i read the title of this therd i said to myself your kiding i also thought ok i must be in the nonsense fourm cause there is no way that is very insane

05-03-2003, 11:10 PM	#11 (permalink)
MSD The sky calls to us ... Super Moderator Location: CT	In CT, a woman having sex with an underage boy is "Influencing a minor," and although she could be charged with unlawfuil carnal knowledge of a minor, it doesn't happen. Only rarely is even the first law applied.

05-04-2003, 01:35 AM	#12 (permalink)
Ashton PORNHOUND Location: California	Hmmmmm, I feel that anyone old enough to father a child should take responsibilty for that childs well being.... but instead of taking his paper route money the state should foot the child support until he is old enough to have a regular job and then garnish his wages and tax returns, It may seem a bit harsh but how else are these young people to learn that you can't just get girls/women pregnant without any consequences?

05-04-2003, 09:11 AM	#16 (permalink)
Infinite Hybrid Crazy	I still don't understand how a 12 year old got a 18 year old women pregnant. I mean wtf? __________________ paramedics fell into the wound like a rehired scab at a barehanded plant an anesthetic penance beneath the hail of contraband

05-04-2003, 09:24 AM	#17 (permalink)
sexylady Upright Location: Victoria, BC	i was under the impression that sex with a minor (regardless of the sex of the minor) was illegal... wouldn't it be considered statutory rape regardless of the circumstances.... i know in Canada women who have sex with boys who are minors get thrown in jail... there's a teacher who had sex with one of her students when he was 12 or something and she is in prison... the boy loves her and fathered her child but she is still in jail.... __________________ eat celery.

05-04-2003, 11:34 AM	#19 (permalink)
Lebell Cracking the Whip Location: Sexymama's arms...	This is just one of those stories that makes me shake my head and wonder about the f***ed up world we live in. 12 yr old boy + 18 yr old woman == OK 12 yr old female + 18 yr old man != OK :/ __________________ "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." – C. S. Lewis The ONLY sponsors we have are YOU! Please Donate!

05-04-2003, 12:34 PM	#20 (permalink)
crypt hound Upright	I think this law situation is because of the long-held (and erroneous) belief that women are the sexually attractive ones, men are the sexually active ones. Therefore the "weaker", more disinterested should be protected. Of course, any girl knows we're just as sexual as men, it's society that has always cast us as sexually meek and we need to comply in order to avoid being labeled "slutty". As for how this applies here, I don't believe this law is fair to men or women.

05-04-2003, 01:16 PM	#22 (permalink)
BBtB ClerkMan! Location: Tulsa, Ok.	What if the woman was 40? The law would be the same but I am sure then there would be a public outcry __________________ Meridae'n once played "death" at a game of chess that lasted for over two years. He finally beat death in a best 34 out of 67 match. At that time he could ask for any one thing and he could wish for the hope of all mankind... he looked death right in the eye and said ... "I would like about three fiddy"

05-04-2003, 03:04 PM	#23 (permalink)
annie1 Insane	oh my gosh, what an interesting story!

05-04-2003, 11:39 PM	#24 (permalink)
nefarious Insane Location: Tucson, AZ	wow .. every time you think the law is fucked up.. you read something else.. there are two people in those instances who are fucked up: 1. The 18 year old taking the money from a 12 year old .. 2. The law for allowing that to happen.. no wonder those christian groups say the end is nigh.. :] __________________ Si vis pacem, para bellum. - Vegetius "Do Re Mil.3, Prol.

05-05-2003, 03:06 AM	#26 (permalink)
MrFlux Fluxing wildly... Location: Auckland, New Zealand	It's just our politicians that are crazy, but as far as I know that's true for every other country as well __________________ flux (n.) Medicine. The discharge of large quantities of fluid material from the body, especially the discharge of watery feces from the intestines.

05-05-2003, 03:48 AM	#27 (permalink)
yabobo Lust Puppy Location: in your closet and in your head...	Not trying to be too funny here When I was 12 if an eighteen year old girl that I liked would even hug me. I would have shot in my jeans. What could this girl even be thinking? Maybe it was a hug in the water or something and the little guys just swam over. If not the little ladie needs some jail time. __________________ Why do they sterilize the needle for lethal injections? Only in America......do we use the word 'politics' to describe the process so well: 'Poli' in Latin meaning 'many' and 'tics' meaning 'bloodsucking creatures'.

05-05-2003, 03:51 AM	#28 (permalink)
pazza Insane Location: Australia	That is really messed up. And besides, how did a 12 year old boy even get with an eigteen year old __________________ The above thoughts are not necessarily the thoughts of this user.

05-05-2003, 06:45 AM	#29 (permalink)
hrdwareguy "Officer, I was in fear for my life" Location: Oklahoma City	Man...at least she should have known better. Maybe she figured, he's 12, I won't get pregnant from him. shrug Guess it takes all kinds. __________________ Gun Control is hitting what you aim at Aim for the TFP, Donate Today

05-05-2003, 07:10 AM	#30 (permalink)
wraithhibn Dopefish Location: the 'Ville	it is a load of shit. she should be registered a sex offender, because young minds are impressionable, and now shes fucked this kid up. __________________ If you won't dress like the Victoria Secret girls, don't expect us to act like soap opera guys.

05-05-2003, 10:14 AM	#31 (permalink)
snowace56 Loser Location: Bakersfield...The rest stop town	well duh...it is illegal. but he got what he deserved. I don't feel sorry for anyone who gets in a position like that. He should have used protection, or better yet NOT SLEEPING WITH 18 YR OLDS!!! This world is going stright to hell!

05-05-2003, 05:05 PM	#32 (permalink)
SeXuaLSoYBeaN Loser Location: Florida	Haha, sux for those underage boys!

05-05-2003, 05:11 PM	#33 (permalink)
ICER Chilled to Perfection Location: Dallas, TX	You have to ask yourself how this boy got the girl pregant to begin with. How does a young boy at that age have sex often enough to do it (I know one time well do, But in reality. It usally takes more then that) Just goes to show you that one bad decsion can really haunt you __________________ What's the difference between congress and a penitentiary? One is filled with tax evaders, blackmailers and threats to society. The other is for housing prisoners. ~~David Letterman

05-05-2003, 05:30 PM	#34 (permalink)
dolemite175 Tilted	How can that be true? I thought the law stated that it was illegal to have sex with minors regardless of what sex you are. Isn't that what they charged that female teacher with?

05-05-2003, 06:32 PM	#35 (permalink)
TrollInvestigtr Crazy	jesus christ i couldnt even shoot a wad until i was 15. forget about getting a female to actually commit sex acts with me. sheesh.

05-05-2003, 06:41 PM	#36 (permalink)
Frosstbyte Winter is Coming Location: The North	:gawks:: That's crazy. Everyone's already said everything that I would've said about double standards and just weird shit going on. Really really fucked up that kids that young have to deal with that.

05-05-2003, 07:19 PM	#37 (permalink)
floatie Upright	Well, here's my "This is so fucked up" replic. And I just started to think that NZ was a nice place and all, kinda like Canada only warmer...

05-05-2003, 08:13 PM	#39 (permalink)
Gortexfogg I and I Location: Stillwater, OK	This is the lamest example of "justice" ever. 18yr old woman (we say 'woman' but she's probably no more mature than a kid) with a 12yr old boy. That 18yr must have been pretty desperate for sex or just plain stupid (or both).

05-05-2003, 08:25 PM	#40 (permalink)
jmf1234 Insane Location: Steel City ( the 'Burgh)	you really have to feel sorry for this kid. Instead of playing video games with his friends his paying child support this is fucking sexist __________________ Let's go Pitt, we're set for victory Sex is like bridge: If you don't have a good partner, you better have a good hand. -- Charles Pierce