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Old 04-28-2003, 07:04 PM   #81 (permalink)
Location: neither here, nor there
This "dreaded" thread sure has spurred alot of comments.
I say leagleise it and let people be.
Y'all watch this.......
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Old 04-28-2003, 09:02 PM   #82 (permalink)
see the links to my music?
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Location: Beautiful British Columbia
glad to see no flaming goin' on.

good points,bad points.....bring 'em on.


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Old 04-29-2003, 03:18 PM   #83 (permalink)
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Marijuana's damage to short-term memory seems to occur because THC alters the way in which information is processed by the hippocampus, a brain area responsible for memory formation. Laboratory rats treated with THC displayed the same reduced ability to perform tasks requiring short-term memory as other rats showed after nerve cells in their hippocampus were destroyed.
Heyser, C.J.; Hampson, R.E.; and Deadwyler, S.A. Effects of delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol on delayed match to sample performance in rats: Alterations in short-term memory associated with changes in task-specific firing of hippocampal cells. Journal of Pharmacology & Experimental Therapeutics 264(1):294-307, 1993.

Acute, reversible actions are not damage: "However, unlike the effects of hippocampal lesions or neurotoxic damage, the effects of delta-9-THC were completely reversible within 24 hr of injection." It later went on to state "...this effect could serve as the basis for the well characterized short-term memory and other cognitive deficits reported in humans after smoking marijuana," popularly known as being high.

As people age, they normally lose neurons in the hippocampus, which decreases their ability to remember events. Chronic THC exposure may hasten the age-related loss of hippocampal neurons. In one series of studies, rats exposed to THC every day for 8 months (approximately 30 percent of their lifespan), when examined at 11 to 12 months of age, showed nerve cell loss equivalent to that of unexposed animals twice their age.
Landfield, P.W.; Cadwallader, L.B.; and Vinsant, S. Quantitative changes in hippocampal structure following long exposure to delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol: Possible mediation of glucocorticoid systems. Brain Res 443(1-2):47-62, 1988.

"However, the animals appeared to be only minimally affected behaviorally by the doses used (highest dose: 8 mg/kg) and no effects of THC were observed on several ultrastructural variables, including synaptic density." What are the implications? How is this supposed to justify prohibition?

Heishman SJ, et al. Comparative effects of alcoho...[PMID:9264076]

Sullivan JM Molecular Neurobiology Laboratory: Cellular and molecular mechanisms underlying learning and memory impairments produced by cannabinoids.

Misner DL: Mechanism of cannabinoid effects on long-term potentiation and depression in hippocampal CA1 neurons.
Explain the implications of these and their findings in regards to safety and prohibition.
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Old 04-30-2003, 01:55 AM   #84 (permalink)
Location: pittsburgh, so to be elsewhere
I would agree with the many who say to decriminalize and regulate similarly to alcohol or tobacco. As a note I do feel the alcohol age should be lower.
who dares wins... and sometimes loses
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Old 04-30-2003, 11:52 AM   #85 (permalink)
Location: Los Angeles
legalize... so I won't go to jail as I am a bud vaporizer.
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Old 04-30-2003, 12:31 PM   #86 (permalink)
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Taken from drugwarfacts.org:

In the Institute of Medicine's report on medical marijuana, the researchers examined the physiological risks of using marijuana and cautioned, "Marijuana is not a completely benign substance. It is a powerful drug with a variety of effects. However, except for the harms associated with smoking, the adverse effects of marijuana use are within the range of effects tolerated for other medications."

Source: Janet E. Joy, Stanley J. Watson, Jr., and John A Benson, Jr., "Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base," Division of Neuroscience and Behavioral Research, Institute of Medicine (Washington, DC: National Academy Press, 1999).

The Institute of Medicine's 1999 report on medical marijuana examined the question of whether marijuana could diminish patients' immune system - an important question when considering marijuana use by AIDS and cancer patients. The report concluded that, "the short-term immunosuppressive effects are not well established but, if they exist, are not likely great enough to preclude a legitimate medical use."

Source: Janet E. Joy, Stanley J. Watson, Jr., and John A Benson, Jr., "Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base," Division of Neuroscience and Behavioral Research, Institute of Medicine (Washington, DC: National Academy Press, 1999).

In spite of the established medical value of marijuana, doctors are presently permitted to prescribe cocaine and morphine - but not marijuana.

Source: The Controlled Substances Act of 1970, 21 U.S.C. 801 et seq.

Organizations that have endorsed medical access to marijuana include: the Institute of Medicine, the American Academy of Family Physicians; American Bar Association; American Public Health Association; American Society of Addiction Medicine; AIDS Action Council; British Medical Association; California Academy of Family Physicians; California Legislative Council for Older Americans; California Medical Association; California Nurses Association; California Pharmacists Association; California Society of Addiction Medicine; California-Pacific Annual Conference of the United Methodist Church; Colorado Nurses Association; Consumer Reports Magazine; Kaiser Permanente; Lymphoma Foundation of America; Multiple Sclerosis California Action Network; National Association of Attorneys General; National Association of People with AIDS; National Nurses Society on Addictions; New Mexico Nurses Association; New York State Nurses Association; New England Journal of Medicine; and Virginia Nurses Association.

Many organizations have favorable positions (e.g., unimpeded research) on medical marijuana. These groups include: The Institute of Medicine, The American Cancer Society; American Medical Association; Australian Commonwealth Department of Human Services and Health; California Medical Association; Federation of American Scientists; Florida Medical Association; and the National Academy of Sciences.

The Controlled Substances Act of 1970 established five categories, or "schedules," into which all illicit and prescription drugs were placed. Marijuana was placed in Schedule I, which defines the substance as having a high potential for abuse, no currently accepted medical use in the United States, and a lack of accepted safety for use under medical supervision. To contrast, over 90 published reports and studies have shown marijuana has medical efficacy.

Source: The Controlled Substances Act of 1970, 21 U.S.C. 801 et seq.; Common Sense for Drug Policy, Compendium of Reports, Research and Articles Demonstrating the Effectiveness of Medical Marijuana, Vol. I & Vol. II (Falls Church, VA: Common Sense for Drug Policy, March 1997).

On September 6, 1988, the Drug Enforcement Administration's Chief Administrative Law Judge, Francis L. Young, ruled:
"Marijuana, in its natural form, is one of the safest therapeutically active substances known....[T]he provisions of the [Controlled Substances] Act permit and require the transfer of marijuana from Schedule I to Schedule II. It would be unreasonable, arbitrary and capricious for the DEA to continue to stand between those sufferers and the benefits of this substance."

Source: US Department of Justice, Drug Enforcement Agency, "In the Matter of Marijuana Rescheduling Petition," [Docket #86-22] (September 6, 1988), p. 57.

The DEA's Administrative Law Judge, Francis Young concluded: "In strict medical terms marijuana is far safer than many foods we commonly consume. For example, eating 10 raw potatoes can result in a toxic response. By comparison, it is physically impossible to eat enough marijuana to induce death. Marijuana in its natural form is one of the safest therapeutically active substances known to man. By any measure of rational analysis marijuana can be safely used within the supervised routine of medical care."

Source: US Department of Justice, Drug Enforcement Agency, "In the Matter of Marijuana Rescheduling Petition," [Docket #86-22], (September 6, 1988), p. 57.

Between 1978 and 1997, 35 states and the District of Columbia passed legislation recognizing marijuana's medicinal value.
States include: AL, AZ, AR, CA, CO, CT, FL, GA, IL, IA, LA, MA, ME, MI, MN, MO, MT, NV, NH, NJ, NM, NY, NC, OH, OK, OR, RI, SC, TN, TX, VT, VA, WA, WV, and WI.
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Old 04-30-2003, 12:43 PM   #87 (permalink)
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Taken from drugwarfacts.org:

In 2000, 46.5 percent of the 1,579,566 total arrests for drug abuse violations were for marijuana -- a total of 734,497. Of those, 646,042 people were arrested for possession alone. This is an increase over 1999, when a total of 704,812 Americans were arrested for marijuana offenses, of which 620,541 were for possession alone.

<table bgcolor="black" border="1" cellpadding="2"><tr><th align="center" colspan="5"><center>Marijuana Arrests and Total Drug Arrests in the US</center></th><tr><center><td>Year</td><td>Total Drug Arrests</td><td>Total Marijuana Arrests</td><td>Marijuana Trafficking/Sale Arrests</td><td>Marijuana Possession Arrests</td></center></tr><tr><td>2000</td><td>1,579,566</td><td>734,497</td><td>88,455</td><td>646,042</td></tr><tr><td>1999</td><td>1,532,200</td><td>704,812</td><td>84,271</td><td>620,541</td></tr><tr><td>1998</td><td>1,559,100</td><td>682,885</td><td>84,191</td><td>598,694</td></tr><tr><td>1995</td><td>1,476,100</td><td>588,964</td><td>85,614</td><td>503,350</td></tr><tr><td>1990</td><td>1,089,500</td><td>326,850</td><td>66,460</td><td>260,390</td></tr><tr><td>1980</td><td>580,900</td><td>401,982</td>

Sources: Federal Bureau of Investigation, Uniform Crime Reports for the United States 2000 (Washington DC: US Government Printing Office, 2001), pp. 215-216, Tables 29 and 4.1; Uniform Crime Reports for the United States 1999 (Washington DC: US Government Printing Office, 2000), pp. 211-212; Federal Bureau of Investigation, Uniform Crime Reports for the United States 1998 (Washington DC: US Government Printing Office, 1999), pp. 209-210; FBI, UCR for the US 1995 (Washington, DC: US Government Printing Office, 1996), pp. 207-208; FBI, UCR for the US 1990 (Washington, DC: US Government Printing Office, 1991), pp. 173-174; FBI, UCR for the US 1980 (Washington, DC: US Government Printing Office, 1981), pp. 189-191.

"Tetrahydrocannabinol is a very safe drug. Laboratory animals (rats, mice, dogs, monkeys) can tolerate doses of up to 1,000 mg/kg (milligrams per kilogram). This would be equivalent to a 70 kg person swallowing 70 grams of the drug -- about 5,000 times more than is required to produce a high. Despite the widespread illicit use of cannabis there are very few if any instances of people dying from an overdose. In Britain, official government statistics listed five deaths from cannabis in the period 1993-1995 but on closer examination these proved to have been deaths due to inhalation of vomit that could not be directly attributed to cannabis (House of Lords Report, 1998). By comparison with other commonly used recreational drugs these statistics are impressive."

Source: Iversen, Leslie L., PhD, FRS, "The Science of Marijuana" (London, England: Oxford University Press, 2000), p. 178, citing House of Lords, Select Committee on Science and Technology, "Cannabis -- The Scientific and Medical Evidence" (London, England: The Stationery Office, Parliament, 1998).

A Johns Hopkins study published in May 1999, examined marijuana's effects on cognition on 1,318 participants over a 15 year period. Researchers reported "no significant differences in cognitive decline between heavy users, light users, and nonusers of cannabis." They also found "no male-female differences in cognitive decline in relation to cannabis use." "These results ... seem to provide strong evidence of the absence of a long-term residual effect of cannabis use on cognition," they concluded.

Source: Constantine G. Lyketsos, Elizabeth Garrett, Kung-Yee Liang, and James C. Anthony. (1999). "Cannabis Use and Cognitive Decline in Persons under 65 Years of Age," American Journal of Epidemiology, Vol. 149, No. 9.

Commissioned by President Nixon in 1972, the National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse concluded that "Marihuana's relative potential for harm to the vast majority of individual users and its actual impact on society does not justify a social policy designed to seek out and firmly punish those who use it. This judgment is based on prevalent use patterns, on behavior exhibited by the vast majority of users and on our interpretations of existing medical and scientific data. This position also is consistent with the estimate by law enforcement personnel that the elimination of use is unattainable."

Source: Shafer, Raymond P., et al, Marihuana: A Signal of Misunderstanding, Ch. V, (Washington DC: National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse, 1972).

The World Health Organization released a study in March 1998 that states: "there are good reasons for saying that [the risks from cannabis] would be unlikely to seriously [compare to] the public health risks of alcohol and tobacco even if as many people used cannabis as now drink alcohol or smoke tobacco."

Source: Hall, W., Room, R. & Bondy, S., WHO Project on Health Implications of Cannabis Use: A Comparative Appraisal of the Health and Psychological Consequences of Alcohol, Cannabis, Nicotine and Opiate Use, August 28, 1995, (contained in original version, but deleted from official version) (Geneva, Switzerland: World Health Organization, March 1998).

Some claim that cannabis use leads to "adult amotivation." The World Health Organization report addresses the issue and states, "it is doubtful that cannabis use produces a well defined amotivational syndrome." The report also notes that the value of studies which support the "adult amotivation" theory are "limited by their small sample sizes" and lack of representative social/cultural groups.

Source: Hall, W., Room, R. & Bondy, S., WHO Project on Health Implications of Cannabis Use: A Comparative Appraisal of the Health and Psychological Consequences of Alcohol, Cannabis, Nicotine and Opiate Use, August 28, 1995 (Geneva, Switzerland: World Health Organization, March 1998).

Australian researchers found that regions giving on-the-spot fines to marijuana users rather than harsher criminal penalties did not cause marijuana use to increase.

Source: Ali, Robert, et al., The Social Impacts of the Cannabis Expiation Notice Scheme in South Australia: Summary Report (Canberra, Australia: Department of Health and Aged Care, 1999), p. 44.

Since 1969, government-appointed commissions in the United States, Canada, England, Australia, and the Netherlands concluded, after reviewing the scientific evidence, that marijuana's dangers had previously been greatly exaggerated, and urged lawmakers to drastically reduce or eliminate penalties for marijuana possession.

Source: Advisory Committee on Drug Dependence, Cannabis (London, England: Her Majesty's Stationery Office, 1969); Canadian Government Commission of Inquiry, The Non-Medical Use of Drugs (Ottawa, Canada: Information Canada, 1970); The National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse, Marihuana: A Signal of Misunderstanding, (Nixon-Shafer Report) (Washington, DC: USGPO, 1972); Werkgroep Verdovende Middelen, Background and Risks of Drug Use (The Hague, The Netherlands: Staatsuigeverij, 1972); Senate Standing Committee on Social Welfare, Drug Problems in Australia-An Intoxicated Society (Canberra, Australia: Australian Government Publishing Service, 1977); Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs, "The classification of cannabis under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971" (London, England, UK: Home Office, March 2002), available on the web from http://www.drugs.gov.uk/ReportsandPu...rugsadvice.pdf ; House of Commons Home Affairs Committee Third Report, "The Government's Drugs Policy: Is It Working?" (London, England, UK: Parliament, May 9, 2002), from the web at http://www.publications.parliament.u.../318/31802.htm and "Cannabis: Our Position for a Canadian Public Policy," report of the Canadian Senate Special Committee on Illegal Drugs (Ottawa, Canada: Senate of Canada, September 2002).

The Canadian Senate's Special Committee on Illegal Drugs recommended in its 2002 final report on cannabis policy that "the Government of Canada amend the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act to create a criminal exemption scheme. This legislation should stipulate the conditions for obtaining licenses as well as for producing and selling cannabis; criminal penalties for illegal trafficking and export; and the preservation of criminal penalties for all activities falling outside the scope of the exemption scheme."

Source: "Cannabis: Our Position for a Canadian Public Policy," report of the Canadian Senate Special Committee on Illegal Drugs (Ottawa, Canada: Senate of Canada, September 2002), p. 46.

In May of 1998, the Canadian Centre on Substance Abuse, National Working Group on Addictions Policy released policy a discussion document which recommended, "The severity of punishment for a cannabis possession charge should be reduced. Specifically, cannabis possession should be converted to a civil violation under the Contraventions Act." The paper further noted that, "The available evidence indicates that removal of jail as a sentencing option would lead to considerable cost savings without leading to increases in rates of cannabis use."

Source: Single, Eric, Cannabis Control in Canada: Options Regarding Possession (Ottawa, Canada: Canadian Centre on Substance Abuse, May 1998).

"Our conclusion is that the present law on cannabis produces more harm than it prevents. It is very expensive of the time and resources of the criminal justice system and especially of the police. It inevitably bears more heavily on young people in the streets of inner cities, who are also more likely to be from minority ethnic communities, and as such is inimical to police-community relations. It criminalizes large numbers of otherwise law-abiding, mainly young, people to the detriment of their futures. It has become a proxy for the control of public order; and it inhibits accurate education about the relative risks of different drugs including the risks of cannabis itself."

Source: Police Foundation of the United Kingdom, "Drugs and the Law: Report of the Independent Inquiry into the Misuse of Drugs Act of 1971", April 4, 2000. The Police Foundation, based in London, England, is a nonprofit organization presided over by Charles, Crown Prince of Wales, which promotes research, debate and publication to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of policing in the UK.
I look forward to hearing your rebuttal.

Last edited by butthead; 04-30-2003 at 12:57 PM..
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Old 04-30-2003, 01:55 PM   #88 (permalink)
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Location: Up yonder
Legalize it. Sorry but I would much rather see a rapist/murderer/true blue criminal going to jail than some poor sap because he had a few joints on him. Or please, go after the heroin & crack dealers first.
You've been a naughty boy....go to my room!
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Old 04-30-2003, 04:13 PM   #89 (permalink)
Location: Sunny So. Cal.
legalize it and control it! There is no reason that the government should be telling me I can't smoke pot, and there is no reason they should be fighting a losing battle with the war on it. Hell they should be growing the chronic and making more money off of me!
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Old 04-30-2003, 06:58 PM   #90 (permalink)
Whatever happens I'll still smoke it!
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Old 04-30-2003, 08:57 PM   #91 (permalink)
Location: Boone, NC
Originally posted by imemine
Whatever happens I'll still smoke it!
hey man, i gotta agree with you there
"Boy, I like that echo... goes right through my head... I had that happen once, but it was chemically induced...." - Steve Earle
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Old 05-01-2003, 07:16 AM   #92 (permalink)
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Absolutely. It doesn't cause any sort of adverse affects that aren't allready covered by alcohol and tobacco. I say legalize it, control it as a drug, and leave the pot heads alone as long as they stay off the road and don't endanger anyone.
"A ouija board just works better if you've made it yourself. It's sortof like how 'Clue' is more interesting when one of you has actually killed someone."
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Old 05-01-2003, 09:26 AM   #93 (permalink)
Location: around the corner
Okay, I've been informed and educated on both sides of this debate and am trully impressed as to the depth of knowlege on this topic.

Last edited by bender; 10-21-2003 at 02:25 PM..
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Old 05-01-2003, 10:26 AM   #94 (permalink)
Location: Bakersfield...The rest stop town
i say legalize, we spend all this money stopping it at the border doesn't do shit. kinda like tobacco and alcohol, just place an age limit on it. i mean tobacco kills 200,000 a year and how much does mary jane kill...ZERO!!!!!
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Old 05-01-2003, 06:17 PM   #95 (permalink)
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prohibition of anything is silly and impossible
...we barely remember what came before this precious moment...
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Old 05-01-2003, 07:39 PM   #96 (permalink)
Location: no trees, fields of wheat
Originally posted by strickendumb
I think to each his own. . . do what you want to do. Its not illegal to kill yourself, so why not?
Well, technically, suicide is a crime. Only thing is they really can't do much about it.

As for marijuana leg/decrim, i feel that you should be able to grow it, and buy it from licensed producers, much like how alcohol is sold. You must have a licence to be able to produce the product that you sell. As I'm talking about alcohol, call me extreme, but I think it should be illegalized. I heard somebody quote "I would rather step over a giggling hippie than confront a drunk with a knife." And I really think that is true. When a person is high on weed, they usually become more careful, ironically, rather than a drunk becoming more and more reckless. However, I would love to be able to find more unbias information about the long term effects of marijuana. The people that say it's comepletey harmless are usually the stoners, and the ones that say that it will adversely affect you and everybody else in your gene pool as long as your family blood remains are usually the ones with extreme anti drug ronald reagan administration thoughts. anyhow... back to the forums
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Old 05-16-2003, 02:33 PM   #97 (permalink)

very nice, thanks for taking the time and effort - I was thinking about it but decided I was too lazy (not from smoking weed though, lol).
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Old 05-16-2003, 04:28 PM   #98 (permalink)
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
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Old 05-18-2003, 07:08 PM   #99 (permalink)
Tax and regulate, Let the cops investigate Crime.
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Old 05-19-2003, 12:50 AM   #100 (permalink)
Know Where!
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Originally posted by degrawj
decriminalize it. if you don't want to smoke it, and hate it, that's fine. then don't smoke it. but some people out there do use it responsibly, and the punishment right now is way to severe.

i completely agree
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dreaded, marijuana, thread

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