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Old 02-01-2004, 08:13 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Gimme the real deal on Frats

I'm still a few months from moving into college, but a girl-friend of mine already at the respective college got the idea of joining a frat into my mind. She joined a Sorority, and speaks nothing but positive things of it.

The thing is that I'm going to a more technical/engineering oriented school, and it just makes sense in my mind that frats there would be different, who knows... Gimme your thoughts and everything on frats, thanks!
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Old 02-01-2004, 09:00 PM   #2 (permalink)
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You pay for your friends...
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Old 02-01-2004, 09:11 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I wasn't in a frat, but I know people who are, so I'll give you what I can.

Basically, there is a period near the beginnign of each semester called the "rush". The different frats hold parties where people who want to join look around, talk to members, and basically decide whether they want to join a frat, and which. Then the frat brothers choose prospective members who become "pledges". At this point, there is a period where the pledges are initiated into the frat, and those that make it join.

I really don't want to go into too much detail, since it may be different where you go to school. Just make sure you think it over and choose a frat where you will feel comfortable.
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Old 02-01-2004, 09:51 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by googleplex
You pay for your friends...
i;d have to agree with this stereotype
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Old 02-02-2004, 02:03 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Old 02-02-2004, 08:01 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I didn't do the greek thing.

My sister and her husband, Alpha Phi and Sigma Kai respectively.

All of their friends are somehow related to the greek system, so now they've been all getting married, buying houses, and now having kids. They've been doing all this stuff together since school.

For some people it's an important pillar. For others it's a ball and chain. For me it wasn't for me, but I didn't neglect anyone who was from a frat, not everyone was an asshole.
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Old 02-02-2004, 08:26 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I did the fraternity thing. I was both Treasurer and President of my house. I was voted top 10 Greek men on a campus that had 4000 fraternity/sorority members. I can honestly say that I wished I had not done it now.

Did it help my social life?

Peripherally it did on occasion as it gave me a circle of friends to go out with and meet girls in bars. Occasionally I would hook up with a girl for the evening. None of these lasted more than a week. What is funny is that I ended up marrying a sorority girl from a house that we had parties with frequently. She didn't like social scenes that much and so wouldn't hang out very long.

Did it help my academic life?

Absolutely not. Mandatory study halls that were nothing more than a social session when I could have been studying effectively at home. The house was always loud, and there was always something to do besides study. I even drank one afternoon and took a history test while completely drunk. I got an 87, so it wasn't too bad.

Did it give me long-lasting friendships?

I occasionally e-mail some of my old friends, but the connection is tenuous at best. I haven't physically seen any one of them in at least 3 years now. I would say no.

All-in-all the experience was overrated. They have their place. They can be a great introduction to new friends and social scenes in college. They aren't for everbody. You just have to know yourself to determine whether or not it would work for you.
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Old 02-02-2004, 10:10 AM   #8 (permalink)
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frats depend on the school, some have low key frats and some high key... in general, if you've got other things going in your life (music, a sports team, a steady gf, good outside friends) the frat wouldn't add much except a 500$ bill (you have to pay for most), and a lot of extra time drinking. Quite frankly joining a frat latches you down into one social scene for the rest of your college career, and I wouldn't advise it
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Old 02-02-2004, 10:11 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I've got friends in fraternaties, and they belong in them. If you feel it's your scene, go for it.
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Old 02-02-2004, 05:01 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Uh... fraternities are for certain types of people. If you like drinking a lot and aren't into the academic aspect of college then yes would probably enjoy yourself.

I go to UW in Seattle, and the fraternities are usually in the headlines for the WRONG reasons. Last fall there was a riot on greek row, last year there was at least one shooting, a few years back a drunk frat boy fell off a balcony of his frat house and died, and of course there usually a couple of date rapes every year.

Whatever floats your boat....
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Old 02-02-2004, 07:35 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Location: Scottsdale, AZ
frats are shit unless they are really focused on what your major is. i go to ASU and i've seen many frats that are nothing more than clubs that are focused on a certain major, whether it be engineering, marketing, or whatever. but i'd have to say that everything else is complete BS. its just parties, sex, alcohol, and drugs. and unless you are prepared to keep yourself inline with all that crap and school almost every night, you WILL fail out of college. its not that hard to do, i've seen many who have.

but honestly, if you are concerned with school, but still like to party, then a frat is not for you. if you are interested in the above mentioned, alcohol, sex, drugs, and partying, then go for it. that and sleeping during classes.
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Old 02-02-2004, 08:40 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Here in Boone, frats don't have a particularly good reputation. And for that matter, neither do sororities.

You will have to make a choice, and your perspective will probably be shaped by it.

My younger brother joined a frat when he hit college, before he was done pledging, he had frat tatooes, got wasted every night, and had shaped his entire worldview around fraternity life. I see his 'friends' as a bunch of sketchy good for nothings who are all about getting drunk and convincing drunk girls to sleep with them. Their house is pretty much straight out of animal house, and I picked up a bunch of flea bites on my ankles when I went to visit one time. He dates a sorority girl, who thinks the most important thing in the world is appearance. Oh yeah, and he was given the boot from the school of engineering in his junior year, and is now starting a new major...philosophy....because he thinks it will be easy. he is also only taking one class.

I chose not to join a frat. I looked at them, and I was unimpressed. Much the same way I was unimpressed by the 'ceremonies' the boy scouts held. The things they did largely seemed pointless. All the fraternities that I looked at also seemed two faced.....They tried to present the image of a group of upstanding young gentlemen setting an example for our generation, but the behavior of *many* of their members was exactly the opposite, and while their poor conduct may not have been encouraged, it was condoned. The only girls I know who were taken advantage of while drunk, were taken advantage of by frat boys (which is made worse by the fact that only a small percentage of our university is greek, and most parties are not frat parties). I used to live right next to a frat house, and they would chuck beer bottles out into my parking lot, get in drunken fistfights outside, hit other cars in the parking lot while trying to drive somewhere drunk, etc. Most people who aren't in fraternities avoid frat parties (at least at my school) because they just aren't friendly, and many girls get harrassed/groped/etc.

My overall impression about the average person who joins a fraternity is that they are socially insecure and are looking to establish themselves as part of a group by pledging, rather than just making friends the old fashioned way.

Of course, not being a part of a fraternity, I probably only see the bad side of them, and I am sure there are good fraternities out there. However, I think my opinions accurately reflect those of the average college student....Do you really want people to mistrust you simply because you are in a fraternity? Is it worth it? It wasn't for me.
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Old 02-02-2004, 09:29 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Wow, lots of hating on Fraternities here...

Given that I just pledged to join one, Ill give my thoughts.

First, and most important--all fraternities are not equal. Instead of jumping to conclusions and accepting all the negative stereotypes out there, go find out for yourself. When I came to college, I had the same mindset as most of the people here. Didnt want to do it, wrong image, etc, etc, etc. And then I found the fraternity that I am in now. Highest GPA on campus, about .4 higher than the university average. Heavy emphasis on academics. For example, during our pledge period, when we are supposed to be at the house at pretty much any available moment, if I *ever* have something more important--class, studying, or just needing to catch up on sleep, thats fine. They dont care, and dont give me shit about it. If I ever dont feel like partying for whatever reason, thats fine too--I dont catch any grief over it. For goodness sake, we have 10 guys in the fraternity that dont drink. We have three Indians and two black people. How many fraternities can say that? I can honestly say that there are a lot of really good, diverse, and intelligent people in there. The partying is there if you want it to be, but there is no pressure to be involved if you dont want to. We dont even get hazed during our pledge period, something fraternities are infamous for.

That said, most of the other fraternities on campus I dont like. A lot of kids that party to hard, and many of them quite frankly live up to that stereotype. I briefly looked at the other houses here and didnt even go back to any of them but the one I am pledging now.

As for reputations, again, it totally depends on your fraternity. Here on campus, my fraternity (Chi Psi) is looked on *very* favorably. Ive heard it called the "good" fraternity a number of different times. Every fraternity seems to be known for its own things. Mine, fortunately, is known for good things. Unfortunately, many others are not.

To sum it up, go look for yourself. Dont take it at face value. There are a lot of people here that clearly do not like the Greek system at all. Thats fine, but I get the impression that a lot of them dont have a complete picture or have merely seen the wrong fraternities.
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Old 02-02-2004, 09:30 PM   #14 (permalink)
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One more thing. I see a difference between the word Fraternity and "frat." Frat has a very negative connotation to it. Many of the houses here on campus live up to the Frat label. Mine, and a few others, I would classify as a Fraternity--a true brotherhood (as cliche as that sounds).
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Old 02-02-2004, 09:34 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Ok I was in a frat 3 of my 4 years in school and while it hurt my grades a bit (always someone to go out with so it was my fault) it was over all a positive experience.

First off ignore the people saying you pay for your friends and the like. Thatís bullshit. Its a typical answer from someone on the outside looking in. Frats are exclusive by nature and that makes people jealous and bitter. Money was the least concern in joining a frat, hell it cost the same to live in house with food as the dorm, and no one was getting rich off it.

Know that different frats are NOT alike, they are very different. Some will be the jock types, the pretty boy types, the stoners, the geeks etc. This is because frats tend to select for people that will fit in with the group. Its not so much elitist, just who wants to hang out with who. A frat with a lot of good students isn't going to get along with a pot head who is selling his books for weed, so the pot head won't be asked to join. Its important you find a frat with the kind of people you want to hang out with. There will be diversity in there, you are not all carbon copies but lets be real, some people donít' play well together.

What a frat gives you is a group of guys much like yourself, in a common location, and a set of traditions and actives which help build friendships.

Socially the parties tend to be great, and its amazing the kind of things you can do with 50 guys working on set up. My favorite of the year was a party we had with a couple of hot tubs, about 10 tons of sand, two teeky heads we turned into a pair of waterfalls flowing down the side stairwells, and various other touches that made it quite different then the normal sausage fest apartment party in college.

Now academically I suffered a small amount but that was my laziness. I took pride on having a good GPA while almost never attending anything but the exams. It was stupid but I was young . On the other hand I had quite a few friends getting all A averages, in very difficult majors, so academically you can still succeed if you are willing to work, just like being anywhere else. Most Universities have a ranking for frat GPA's, you can check that out if you are worried about slipping academically.

Most importantly I met a girl, freshman, in a hot tub, who I later married and have been with for 13 years now. Glad I was at that frat party
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Old 02-02-2004, 09:51 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: Gimme the real deal on Frats

Quote:
Originally posted by Wingless
I'm still a few months from moving into college, but a girl-friend of mine already at the respective college got the idea of joining a frat into my mind. She joined a Sorority, and speaks nothing but positive things of it.

The thing is that I'm going to a more technical/engineering oriented school, and it just makes sense in my mind that frats there would be different, who knows... Gimme your thoughts and everything on frats, thanks!
Ok after posting this just hit me.

Your GF.

My then GF now wife was in a sorority, and in case you didn't figure it out women think differently then men

While frats tend to be rather lose, sororities are much more structured (and cleaner). There are a lot of activities they do based around dating, and more importantly dating a fraternity guy. Its not a requirement, but they seem to like these sort of things.

First there is the lavalearing (not sure how to spell it but I KNOW my wife does) ceremony. Then the pinning ceremony, THEN the engagement ceremony. (plus side is you get 2 extra steps to keep their mind off the ring a while heh)

There are formal dances, informal dances, parties, etc as well. You being in a frat will make it a whole lot more fun for HER as well. Now as a guy you most likely won't care about these things much but she will.
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Old 02-03-2004, 07:42 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Quote:
Originally posted by Ustwo
Ok I was in a frat 3 of my 4 years in school and while it hurt my grades a bit (always someone to go out with so it was my fault) it was over all a positive experience.

First off ignore the people saying you pay for your friends and the like. Thatís bullshit. Its a typical answer from someone on the outside looking in. Frats are exclusive by nature and that makes people jealous and bitter. Money was the least concern in joining a frat, hell it cost the same to live in house with food as the dorm, and no one was getting rich off it.

Know that different frats are NOT alike, they are very different. Some will be the jock types, the pretty boy types, the stoners, the geeks etc. This is because frats tend to select for people that will fit in with the group. Its not so much elitist, just who wants to hang out with who. A frat with a lot of good students isn't going to get along with a pot head who is selling his books for weed, so the pot head won't be asked to join. Its important you find a frat with the kind of people you want to hang out with. There will be diversity in there, you are not all carbon copies but lets be real, some people donít' play well together.

What a frat gives you is a group of guys much like yourself, in a common location, and a set of traditions and actives which help build friendships.

Socially the parties tend to be great, and its amazing the kind of things you can do with 50 guys working on set up. My favorite of the year was a party we had with a couple of hot tubs, about 10 tons of sand, two teeky heads we turned into a pair of waterfalls flowing down the side stairwells, and various other touches that made it quite different then the normal sausage fest apartment party in college.

Now academically I suffered a small amount but that was my laziness. I took pride on having a good GPA while almost never attending anything but the exams. It was stupid but I was young . On the other hand I had quite a few friends getting all A averages, in very difficult majors, so academically you can still succeed if you are willing to work, just like being anywhere else. Most Universities have a ranking for frat GPA's, you can check that out if you are worried about slipping academically.

Most importantly I met a girl, freshman, in a hot tub, who I later married and have been with for 13 years now. Glad I was at that frat party

THANK you. Someone here not bashing fraternities without having been in one...
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Old 02-03-2004, 01:32 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I too was a president of a national fraternity at a big Greek Campus. I'd have to disagree with Skysooner, because if I had it to do again, I would do the same thing all over. While I don't see many people anymore, and only communicate via occasional emails, those were very close friends at the time, and made college a great experience.
Here are some random thoughts on this topic:
Be careful and figure out beforehand the reputation of the group you are thinking about joining. I had a close friend in law school who had gone to my school as an undergrad, and he made an ill-informed decision based on limited exposure to other groups early in his college career and wound up regretting it throughout college.
Some schools just have local fraternities, and some have local and national ones. There are advantages and disadvantages both ways. To my knowledge, locals are more likely to do the heavy hazing associated with fraternities now. There're no guidelines and little if any accountability. You obviously won't have counterparts at other schools for parties at football games, etc.. On the other hand, you won't have to pay "nationals taxes" or deal with nationals reps coming by onc or twice a year to look over your shoulder or getting in trouble with the IFC.

Do not pick a national fraternity based on national reputation or because your friend at some other school went whatever, or anything other than the people involved at your school. Every national fraternity has some good chapters and some bad ones. Every fraternity has some secret rituals where you learn the secret meanings of the letters. None of that matters. What does matter is the people at your school that are in a certain group, and their reputation at your school.

Employers like people that were in fraternities. To them it means someone who has social skills, and even if they don't have alot of employment history, have some experience in seeing a task through to completion or team leading.
Don't let anyone kid you, Greek life is more expensive than not being involved. From dues to T shirts to misc. expenses just because you have more to do socially.

PLedging a fraternity is not conducive to maintaining a girlfriend. You need to know that going in.

Fraternities are a social lubricant, in some ways similar to alcohol. As an example: Just as you might not talk to some girl without a little to drink, you might not ask some girl on a date without a party coming up that you have to have a date for.
Greek life is helpful to some lost souls because they have a place to belong, and a place to be and something to do socially, if they get in. It is also helpful for people that get involved, because they can get interview conversation material, and the experience in leading a group or responsibility. However, it is most helpful to those that just want to have fun, and can afford it.

You're not buying friends, just as you don't buy an education. Yes, you pay money, but they won't give you a diploma unless you complete the classes and hopefully learn something. Similarly, although you pay money in dues, you won't have friends without the shared experiences and parties and hanging out that you do in a fraternity, and making friends like you make grades to get a degree.

Hazing among almost everyone has gone down dramatically in the last several years, and many, if not most chapters, from my understanding, don't just give lip service to a dry pledgeship anymore, but actually do it. There is too much liability otherwise, and people have started to realize this.

Save the "it will halp my grades" for your parents. It won't, but there are plenty of people that make good grades in fraternities. If you do it, do it for fun, not because your girlfriend wants you to, and not to have future connections, but because you find a place where you think you'd fit in, and because you think it will be fun.

Last edited by dy156; 02-03-2004 at 01:38 PM..
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Old 02-04-2004, 12:40 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I was in Phi Gamma Delta in college for about 2.5 years. It was OK, but not awesome. I don't drink, so I never got crazy wasted with the brothers. Most of the guys were cool, but some were real buttholes, which will be the case everywhere. If you want to be in a frat, you have to be prepared to hang out with the guys a lot. Don't bother joining if you don't plan to spend lots of time at the house, just hanging out. The whole point (despite the pitch you get at Rush) is to make a group of friends and spend time together, even if it's doing nothing. Also, you get to learn a lot of 'secrets' that you can have pride in knowing.

Oh, and ONLY fraternity brothers will say 'fraternity'. Everyone else says frat - it's easier. But, your brothers will say "you don't call your country a cunt do you?" Whatever.
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Old 02-04-2004, 12:54 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I was in a fraternity for some time. I would probably say that although many stereotypes are true, a fraternity is something that you will get out what you put into it. Its difficult to get a sense of which one is right for you because they can be vastly different from one another. People say you pay for your friends. So I would suggest you become friends with them first to know what you are going to pay for. Then it is no longer "paying for friends", its "you and your buddies pooling some money to have a good time." Fraternities get a bad rap. The one that I joined had very little to do with the stereotypes, but I don't believe we were the norm. I've never been a big drinker and was never chastised for it. I can honestly say I was never hazed. It was a very fun experience and if I "bought my friends" than I would say their friendship was definitely worth it. They are still my best friends years later. Its not for everybody, but I'm glad I took part in it.
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Old 02-04-2004, 07:31 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I didn't join a frat, but I rushed every year for the free food and drink. Also it's helpful when you want to get into their parties later in the year. I had a few good (not great) friends who were in frats, they were decent guys. My rule was to invite them to stuff, but don't be suprised or dissapointed if they don't show up.

As far as sororities go, the girls are great, just remember they can be a little flaky. There is nothing better than having a friend in a sorority actively looking to find girlfriends for you among her sisters. I didn't date any of them long term, but it made parties better knowing it wouldn't just be all of my guy roommates.

In the end it comes down to what kind of person you are. If you're naturally pretty social, a frat can be a great place. If you're more independent, I suggest making friends with the frat guys in your dorm, so at least you have the option of going to parties and stuff when you feel like it.
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Old 02-04-2004, 09:58 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Every frat and sorority is different. DGs at one school may be top-of-the-line, while at another they're two steps below Titney Spheres.

Skysooner (and I'm going to go out on a limb and guess he went to the University of Oklahoma like I did) has a near dead-on assessment of most fraternities here in Norman. I delivered pizzas in my younger days, and I got to see what the rushes and PR don't show: the Thursday night trashings at the Pike house, vomit in the living room at the Fijis almost weekly, the passed-out people in the hallways at the DTD, the urine-soaked carpets at Lambda Chi Alpha, and the ATO who tried to rape me during a pizza delivery. (I don't think he'll ever get all of his blood off of his trophy I bludgeoned him with.)

I also saw Sigma Nu and the DUs with almost sorority levels of cleanliness in their houses and SAEs boasting the highest GPA in the IFC, Kappa Sigs helping out with Habitat for Humanity, and Beta Theta Pi were almost always the best tippers. (As any who has worked for tips can tell you, the truest measure of person's goodness is by how much they tip. )

If you can, find some way to get the real scoop before selecting a fraternity. They are all different, some may be the first step on the road and others may leave you for roadkill.
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Old 02-04-2004, 10:18 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Yeah, it was the University of Oklahoma. I hear it can be different in different places, but it was just a bunch of craziness when I was there. It was great the freshman year, but it just got to be a hassle the older I got.
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