Quickness training; need begginers'/n00b advice - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

CityOfAngels · 08-01-2005, 03:10 PM

The following paragraph may seem off-topic, but please don't worry, I'm getting to a point:
I'm 6' tall and 250 lbs. I have a gut and I must admit I have a bit of a case of man-boobs. But the thing is, people tell me all the time that I don't look fat at all. 250 lbs. is a LOT of force pushing downward for a guy that's only 6' tall. Reason I assume this is because I hear about Centers in the NBA that weigh about 234-255 lbs., and they're usually 6'11"-7'4". But as I said, my friends, ex girlfriends, and even a nutritionalist I met up with the other day all express great surprise when they find out that I'm 250 lbs. My conclusion is I have a lot of muscle that I don't even know about, and even though I am fat, a lot of my weight is probably due to the amount of muscle in my body.

The thing is, I can't fight for shit (which was recently demonstrated), and when I play basketball against quality players, I don't fare too well when in the post or when trying to cross them over. So I figured my main problem isn't my strength (which I know I still have to work on), but my quickness. I'm just not quick at all. I can run real fast, but when it comes to quick, jolting movements, I fail miserably. I want to fix this. I want to enhance my quickness, not just my speed and strength.

Where do I start?

kangaeru · 08-01-2005, 06:21 PM

Sprints. Lots of them. 40 yard dashes are king for football. You need to run fast as you can, rest 30 seconds, then do it again, and repeat that 10 times, and then have a 5 min break in between and complete the cycle twice more, for a total of 3.

In addition you can buy yourself one of those lay down rope ladders, there's lots of different footwork drills you can do to speed up your feet and improve your balance and coordination.

And of course, losing some of those 250lbs will help too. Imagine trying to be fast running with a 50lb weight on your back--that's what you're doing now. If you get down to 200lbs you're going to feel light as a feather, and if you've been doing these drills, you will probably be one of the fastest most agile cats on the bball court.

raeanna74 · 08-01-2005, 06:39 PM

Do stretching exercises. If you are stiff you won't go as far in a movement or as quickly. Stretch in every direction before you play those basketball and things. Doing jumprope - it'll limber up your arms and get your coordination going.

shakran · 08-01-2005, 06:46 PM

As for fighting, you have to train. A lot. You need to train yourself to relax when you're punching - the tenser (yes I know that's not a word) you are the slower you punch. But it takes a lot of work to get to the point where you can throw quick punches. Speedbags can help, to a point, but you have to be careful with them. You can easilly get in the habit of throwing quick fluttery punches that make the bag move nice and pretty but wouldn't do any damage in a real fight. You don't wanna train yourself into that corner.

Now, here's a trick to be quicker than you really are. You probably fight like most people - that is you put your fists up, and hold them there until you throw the punch.

Try moving your hands around. If you watch good fighters, their hands are always moving. The eye is VERY good at quickly seeing something go from motionless to being in motion, and the brain computes the trajectory of the new motion very quickly. But they're not quite as good at seeing motion flowing into a different motion. You'll gain a speed advantage if you keep the fists moving.

Siege · 08-01-2005, 07:11 PM

I think he's more interested in being quick than tips on fighting

Bump to what kangaeru said. You need to lose weight. You won't lose weight doing sprints. I recommend doing long distance work first. Once you lose some weight, that's when you can start building up your speed.

Another thing to point out is that you don't want to just improve your quickness. You also need to be able to MAINTAIN that speed. Basketball isn't over in 10 seconds like the 100 metre dash. Doesn't matter how fast you are if you can't keep it up over the course of the game. Make sure you balance your speed with endurance.

shakran · 08-01-2005, 07:12 PM

Well I read this:

Quote:

The thing is, I can't fight for shit (which was recently demonstrated)

and since people had already given him basketball advice I figured I'd address his other complaint.

CityOfAngels · 08-01-2005, 10:13 PM

Thank you all for your input! And yes, shakran, your post is as relevant as everyone else's. Seige, I don't have any trouble keeping up in a game of basketball. I'm actually very fast. I'm 250 lbs, but I can run faster than my track-team friends (I was never on track team before, but I've ran with them in certain incidents before, and I was always faster than them). Granted, they have more stamina and hence endurance than I do, but stamina and endurance isn't a primary problem of mine when it comes to basketball. When I play, I play for 4-6 hours straight. My main problem is quickness and coordination. I can do a nasty crossover, but against experienced players, it's pretty much useless because I'm not very quick at all. I'm taller than a lot of people I play with, but I still have trouble in the post because I'm not always able to get the ball above my head quick enough. Too many times it's either smacked out of my hands as I'm bringing it up, or they're able to get that hand in my face as I'm shooting.

That's another thing I need to work on: quick shooting. My outside shot is competetive, but again, not quick at all. That leaves me only shooting when I'm way open. If I'm tightly guarded, I'm usually not quick enough to get an effective shot off before the defense reacts. Usually when I hit shots like that, like I said I'm usually really open, or just taller than my defender. I've played against And1's "50" before, and let me tell you: shooting over him was a chore. And it was mainly because of his height and my lack of quickness. He was dunking all over me, and I only hit three three-pointers in the entire game. That was it, and it was only because I caught him slipping. If he was on the ball like he should've been, he would've had three more easy blocks.

Thorny · 08-29-2005, 03:39 PM

There are two types of muscle tissue, longer fibers that are better for endurance and strength, and shorter, bunchy fibers that are "twitch muscles" good for sprints and short powerful movement. People have different combinations of each. If you have lots of longer muscle fiber in your legs, you can train the twitch muscles you have to be very good at sprints, but if you have more long muscle fibers, you'll never be an olympic sprinter. Same idea with marathon runners.

Still, it doesn't seem like you have the olympics in mind. When training, try a few very powerful quick movements (after a very good warm-up) but don't overwork the twitch muscles, they get tired and torn fast.

On another track, if you're having trouble with those quick jolting movements, work on flexibility and balance. Its not the muscle, its how you use it. Work on lifting from your center, staying balanced, moving lightly and fluidly. Take dance classes. If your broken-backed pirouette doesn't set you up for the perfect layup, at least it'll have 'em laughing too hard to block your shot.

Seriously. Dance classes... or martial arts. The early classes focus on the same skills, and if you've ever been to an audition, you'll know just how much of a martial art dance can be.

08-01-2005, 03:10 PM	#1 (permalink)
CityOfAngels Oh shit it's Wayne Brady! Location: Passenger seat of Wayne Brady's car.	Quickness training; need begginers'/n00b advice The following paragraph may seem off-topic, but please don't worry, I'm getting to a point: I'm 6' tall and 250 lbs. I have a gut and I must admit I have a bit of a case of man-boobs. But the thing is, people tell me all the time that I don't look fat at all. 250 lbs. is a LOT of force pushing downward for a guy that's only 6' tall. Reason I assume this is because I hear about Centers in the NBA that weigh about 234-255 lbs., and they're usually 6'11"-7'4". But as I said, my friends, ex girlfriends, and even a nutritionalist I met up with the other day all express great surprise when they find out that I'm 250 lbs. My conclusion is I have a lot of muscle that I don't even know about, and even though I am fat, a lot of my weight is probably due to the amount of muscle in my body. The thing is, I can't fight for shit (which was recently demonstrated), and when I play basketball against quality players, I don't fare too well when in the post or when trying to cross them over. So I figured my main problem isn't my strength (which I know I still have to work on), but my quickness. I'm just not quick at all. I can run real fast, but when it comes to quick, jolting movements, I fail miserably. I want to fix this. I want to enhance my quickness, not just my speed and strength. Where do I start?

08-01-2005, 06:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
kangaeru Crazy Location: on the road to where I want to be...	Sprints. Lots of them. 40 yard dashes are king for football. You need to run fast as you can, rest 30 seconds, then do it again, and repeat that 10 times, and then have a 5 min break in between and complete the cycle twice more, for a total of 3. In addition you can buy yourself one of those lay down rope ladders, there's lots of different footwork drills you can do to speed up your feet and improve your balance and coordination. And of course, losing some of those 250lbs will help too. Imagine trying to be fast running with a 50lb weight on your back--that's what you're doing now. If you get down to 200lbs you're going to feel light as a feather, and if you've been doing these drills, you will probably be one of the fastest most agile cats on the bball court. __________________ Dont be afraid to change who you are for what you could become

08-01-2005, 06:39 PM	#3 (permalink)
raeanna74 I'm not a blonde! I'm knot! I'm knot! I'm knot! Location: Upper Michigan	Do stretching exercises. If you are stiff you won't go as far in a movement or as quickly. Stretch in every direction before you play those basketball and things. Doing jumprope - it'll limber up your arms and get your coordination going. __________________ "Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

08-01-2005, 07:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
Siege is a tiger Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada	I think he's more interested in being quick than tips on fighting Bump to what kangaeru said. You need to lose weight. You won't lose weight doing sprints. I recommend doing long distance work first. Once you lose some weight, that's when you can start building up your speed. Another thing to point out is that you don't want to just improve your quickness. You also need to be able to MAINTAIN that speed. Basketball isn't over in 10 seconds like the 100 metre dash. Doesn't matter how fast you are if you can't keep it up over the course of the game. Make sure you balance your speed with endurance. __________________ "Your name's Geek? Do you know the origin of the term? A geek is someone who bites the heads off chickens at a circus. I would never let you suck my dick with a name like Geek" --Kevin Smith This part just makes my posts easier to find

08-01-2005, 06:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
shakran Tone.	As for fighting, you have to train. A lot. You need to train yourself to relax when you're punching - the tenser (yes I know that's not a word) you are the slower you punch. But it takes a lot of work to get to the point where you can throw quick punches. Speedbags can help, to a point, but you have to be careful with them. You can easilly get in the habit of throwing quick fluttery punches that make the bag move nice and pretty but wouldn't do any damage in a real fight. You don't wanna train yourself into that corner. Now, here's a trick to be quicker than you really are. You probably fight like most people - that is you put your fists up, and hold them there until you throw the punch. Try moving your hands around. If you watch good fighters, their hands are always moving. The eye is VERY good at quickly seeing something go from motionless to being in motion, and the brain computes the trajectory of the new motion very quickly. But they're not quite as good at seeing motion flowing into a different motion. You'll gain a speed advantage if you keep the fists moving.

08-01-2005, 10:13 PM	#7 (permalink)
CityOfAngels Oh shit it's Wayne Brady! Location: Passenger seat of Wayne Brady's car.	Thank you all for your input! And yes, shakran, your post is as relevant as everyone else's. Seige, I don't have any trouble keeping up in a game of basketball. I'm actually very fast. I'm 250 lbs, but I can run faster than my track-team friends (I was never on track team before, but I've ran with them in certain incidents before, and I was always faster than them). Granted, they have more stamina and hence endurance than I do, but stamina and endurance isn't a primary problem of mine when it comes to basketball. When I play, I play for 4-6 hours straight. My main problem is quickness and coordination. I can do a nasty crossover, but against experienced players, it's pretty much useless because I'm not very quick at all. I'm taller than a lot of people I play with, but I still have trouble in the post because I'm not always able to get the ball above my head quick enough. Too many times it's either smacked out of my hands as I'm bringing it up, or they're able to get that hand in my face as I'm shooting. That's another thing I need to work on: quick shooting. My outside shot is competetive, but again, not quick at all. That leaves me only shooting when I'm way open. If I'm tightly guarded, I'm usually not quick enough to get an effective shot off before the defense reacts. Usually when I hit shots like that, like I said I'm usually really open, or just taller than my defender. I've played against And1's "50" before, and let me tell you: shooting over him was a chore. And it was mainly because of his height and my lack of quickness. He was dunking all over me, and I only hit three three-pointers in the entire game. That was it, and it was only because I caught him slipping. If he was on the ball like he should've been, he would've had three more easy blocks.

08-29-2005, 03:39 PM	#8 (permalink)
Thorny Upright Location: Ohio	There are two types of muscle tissue, longer fibers that are better for endurance and strength, and shorter, bunchy fibers that are "twitch muscles" good for sprints and short powerful movement. People have different combinations of each. If you have lots of longer muscle fiber in your legs, you can train the twitch muscles you have to be very good at sprints, but if you have more long muscle fibers, you'll never be an olympic sprinter. Same idea with marathon runners. Still, it doesn't seem like you have the olympics in mind. When training, try a few very powerful quick movements (after a very good warm-up) but don't overwork the twitch muscles, they get tired and torn fast. On another track, if you're having trouble with those quick jolting movements, work on flexibility and balance. Its not the muscle, its how you use it. Work on lifting from your center, staying balanced, moving lightly and fluidly. Take dance classes. If your broken-backed pirouette doesn't set you up for the perfect layup, at least it'll have 'em laughing too hard to block your shot. Seriously. Dance classes... or martial arts. The early classes focus on the same skills, and if you've ever been to an audition, you'll know just how much of a martial art dance can be.