itchy92

I've been fuming about something for a long time now, and I guess this is a good place to vent and get other people's perspectives.
What is with all these "punk" bands in the mainstream? How does that work? I thought the whole idea of punk was to be underground, counter-culture, blah blah blah? I'm not talking so much about the content of the songs (I like the newer, romanticist stuff as much as the old politipunk stuff), but as to what the bands are doing. I understand that when a band is good, they deserve to get big; I fully support that. But catering to the mainstream is an entirely different thing. The music they produce lacks the sincerity which originally drew me to punk music: it all seems like they're just doing it for money and fame, and I think it's killing the genre.
Bands like Good Charlotte, A New Found Glory, A Simple Plan, All-American Rejects, The Used -- there are so many nowadays that it's pointless to list-- are not punk! Granted, their music is catchy and sometimes good, but it doesn't convey the sincerity that it used to. I dread going to most shows now, because I know I'll be swarmed by little teenybopping 14-year-olds who think they're so hardcore, when in fact, they have no idea what the music is all about.
I don't know; there's so much I want to say on the subject that it's hard to get it all out, much less organize it. I'm not a mohawk-sporting, leather/spike wearing anarchist or anything, but I am a firm supporter of sincerity. And bands that are sincere and true to punk don't show up on MTV.
I commend the ever-dwindling number of bands that don't give in to selling out. I'm interested to see what you all think, whether it's that I'm right or I'm a complete idiot.

Itchy92

Mr.Deflok

I bet none of those fuckers have evern heard of Iggy Pop, Ziggy Stardust and the countless other brit acts that made Punk.

This nu-punk is bullfuck.

KillerYoda

Eventually everything good is corrupted, and punk rock is just another example. It's unavoidable.

__________________
"So you're Chekov, huh? Well, this here's McCoy. Find a Spock, we got us an away team."

absorbentishe

Okay, long time punk fan here, I agree to a point. If you take a close look at The Ramones, they were, for the most part, the first punk band, every other punk act took what they did to a different level. Many many of their songs are now the background music for ads on TV, does this make The Ramones any less than what they are?

The punk bands of today are trying to capitalize on the "success" of Green Day, that originally is a punk band. I like some of the music, but I wouldn't call it punk, no way... Their music is sort of a throw back to the "hair band" days of the eighties. I might listen to it, but it's not the same. It definately isn't like any of the bands that "didn't" make it big, but everyone knew.

brandon11983

it sucks ass. nailbomb is fucking punk.

__________________
Well behaved women rarely make history.

Derwood

Good Charlotte is one of the worst bands of all time

__________________
"You can't shoot a country until it becomes a democracy." - Willravel

Leander

I like the analogy to the hair bands of the 80's. What these new bands are doing is the same pre-packaged cookie cutter crap that was "metal" in the late 80's. I miss the genuine attitude that all the great bands had. The Clash, Minor Threat, The Buzzcocks, they were the real deal.

__________________
Just me and God, watching Scotty die..

BulletBob

Sadly, I can't think of many punk bands still together today. NOFX, Pennywise, Bad Religion, a few others i'm probably missing.

nate_dawg

"mtv get off the air"

fuelmyfire

i fucking hate nu-punk. my city is flooded with local bands that play it.

it takes a lot to get me to say that i "hate" a style of music.

itchy92

absorbentishe: No, the Ramones now being played as ad music is not the same; they did not make mindless music with a specific sound with the intent of being popular; they were a good band (well...) that made it big.

Leander: That's exactly the problem. They all have the same sound, or perhaps some minor variation thereof. That's always been the case with any music that is popular, though; all rap has exactly one beat, just sped up or slowed down.

And although I definitely recognize and appreciate the roots of the genre, it's not that I hate all "punk" music out there today, just the crap that's attracting all these poseurs to the genre. And the problem is, most of them don't use it as a launching pad into good stuff, they just continue to listen to the same popular crap.

I'll admit: New Found Glory was my first punk band. But after a few months, I realized how much more, real music was out there, and I realized what the music is about. Over the last two years, I've found hundreds of punk/indie/emo bands that I love that no one has ever heard of. I almost always go to shows alone because none of my friends know the bands I listen to, and I refuse to go to their Sum 41 shows... I guess I'm just trying to reiterate that there is music out there which could still be deemed punk, as long as you have a broader definition of it.

Itchy92

Bob Biter

As an avid reader of The Onion, I think one of last week's top stories would be a great addition to this punk discussion. Enjoy!

http://www.theonion.com/onion3919/90s_punk.html

__________________
A plan is just a list of things that don't happen.

bleeckerx

thats an interesting article, but it gives way too much credit to " punk in the early 90s" which i think is almost an oxymoron. Punk BARELY made it thru the 80s- ( let alone thrive in the 90s ) and if there are any true punk bands around anymore- 99% of us havent heard them- cause real punk rock is furiously underground. I mean thats one of the foundations of REAL punk rock. This shit today- new found glory, charlotte whatever - its mallpunk. Mass produced, prepackaged for your easy listening enjoyment...

so basically its anything BUT punk. However those of us who know better wont listen to it- and the kids who are tired of nysnc and are growin up WILL listen to it. Oh well. It went the way of metal i suppose ( 80s metal not the REAL shit we got underground these days : )

And it only took what - 25 some years for american pop culture to pick up and bastardize punk- not a bad run...


oh btw ive seen goodcharlotte, newfound glory and sum 41 in concert YESSS

__________________
no heros here

bleeckerx

oh and what THE HELL was that about rap beats being all the same, only at different speeds!?! anyone else catch that?!? lol

__________________
no heros here

absorbentishe

Oh that article made me laugh.... Nothing like thinking you were "there" when it happened. Can't condem him for actually knowing a band that was before his time though. The onion must have not had anything better.

As for the bands of today, personally, I don't consider them punk in any way shape or form, if compared to any of the real punk bands. Sum 41 are just punks, good charlotte and all the others are wanna be punks.

<B>itchy92</B>, I was only making a correlation between punk being anti establishment, and now be mainstream. The Ramones are in no way associated with the new punks...

Bob Biter

Ah, bleeckerx and absorbentishe, The Onion is a satirical newspaper. That article was completely fabricated in light of the ongoing "what is punk?" debates that are all the rage these days. It used the fictional opinion of a fictional 29 y-o to illustrate that people will always shun the tastes of those younger than them, claiming they "weren't there" when it was still good.

God bless The Onion.

__________________
A plan is just a list of things that don't happen.

sadistikdreams

fuck. i hate "nu-punk". and emo. why cant emo just be called POP! PUNK is about being pissed. PUNK was fast, angry hard hitting riffs, not "why you got to make things so complictated". everyone is just in it for the money, nowadays. fuck money.

__________________
"Besides the noble art of getting things done, there is the noble art of leaving things undone.
The wisdom of life consists in the elimination of non-essentials."
-Lin Yutang

hearts, by d.a.

pornisbadforyou

that onion article was hilarious

bleeckerx

well i DO feel like a jackass...... lol

and ive always credited myself as being able to pick up on good satire- im so ashamed- hahaha glad i didnt REALLY blast that story then-

__________________
no heros here

bleeckerx

oh also tho, seriously EMO has NOTHING to do with punk... AT ALL ( atleast in its current manifestations )whoever ur hearin that term from has butchered it.. although its a common mistake, i thought it was the same thing until a year ago.. but i wont go into an emo rant unless someone actually wants to hear the finer points.... : )

__________________
no heros here

itchy92

bleeckerx: Yes, I am now mathematically able to break down any rap beat to the same exact pattern!

Spektr

I can't stand this shit. They're out to make a buck just like the Backstreet Boys. The only difference I see between boy bands and pop-punk groups, is the fact that they can play 4 chords over and over on an electric guitar. There is absolutely no talent in any of the lyrics of Sum 41, Good Charlotte and the plethora of other horseshit bands who call themselves punk.

bleeckerx

actually in all fairness, sum 41 and new found glory do have a good amount of talent- but then again i guess so do boy bands at some levels...

__________________
no heros here

Spungfoo

I pay absolutely no attention to them, and you, dear reader, should do the same. Well, there are good punk bands out there nowadays, but you won't find them anywhere but parties or a garage

bleeckerx

amen spungfoo

__________________
no heros here

Heel Turn

Fear not, there's still some good punk bands left, and some new awesome bands on the horizon. Go to shows, check websites, and ask around. There's some great bands out there, you just need to find them before MTV does.

And as for the current wave of pop punk? It's shit.

Pure, unadulterated shit.

Thraeryn

I like Sum 41 for novelty purposes: I don't think of them as punk, just as a band of kids who remember the hair bands of the 80s and try to have fun with their sound.

They're pretty good that way.

Radio Monk33

Ah the constant "no talent, shitty musician" bashing. But cmon, who's big and famous? (Hint: its bands like Sum41, blink 182 and so on, not You).

I personally prefer not to devote my self to any one subsect of punk. I like irishfolk punk, pop punk like the Ataris, to political stuff like Pennywise and anything in between.

Anyways, I see this as the constant evolution of music. People will always complain about the music kids listen to, and how it was so much more pure back in the day...

__________________
"Punk rock had this cool, political personal message. It was a bit more cerebral than just stupid cock rock, you know"
-Kurt Cobain

emopwr

emo emo emo. i think that term is more of a joke now than anything. half of the bands that are supposedly 'emo' cringe at the thought of being called that. labeling of music is just dumb. you like what you like, if you dont, who gives a shit. doesnt make sense to go spouting everything sucks because it isnt the 'punk' i knew back in the day. and people are always saying 'punk is dead', or punk got 'corrupted' by big money. guess what killed it? people grew up, moved on. if everyone was still listening to punk, youd have a shit load more of it around. but all those people who loved it back in the day, ovbiously DONT anymore. there would be more punk like that if that were the case. music is always changing. dont blame the teenagers for this new wave of pop punk stuff. you were doing the same thing listening to your old school punk. i know someones gonna say 'oh but it wasnt like that, it was about the message and we were hardcore and rawr...' but who cares. the old stuff is still there. this new shit isnt stopping you from listening to your fav music. hell, i thought it was a lot cooler when stuff was underground, cuz once a band goes mainstream, its not cool anymore. right? cant be popular or pop or make money, I GUESS THEY ALL SOLD OUT. i dunno if that made any sense. but ok. im not trying to start a flame war or anyhting, but i really do love music. i listen to many different types and it has had a really big impact on my life. pisses me off when people start ranting about how good their music was and how everythign else now sucks and isnt as good.

as for good punk bands that are still active? i dunno, id have to say propagandhi is one of my favs, as are some other stuff on their label.

bleeckerx

emo is a joke term to some, mostly the people who have no clue what it is. ( funny how that works ) i agree music is an evolution but there are some poor steps in the course of evolution. As to the labeling of music, it gets a bad wrap because the people doing most of the labeling are just running thier mouths. I think if all music was labelled correctly no one would have a problem with it? it sounds real obvious but ive never heard anyone bitch over calling miss spears " pop " oooooo i said it! POP

well its accurate, so we have no problem,right?

so im tryin to rally support for a government run research program to classify and label the different genres of music. I think its important for us as a nation to see something like this through.

anyway the real culprit here is ignorance- people talkin shit without knowin shit, but come on-its just easier that way...

: )

__________________
no heros here

emopwr

interesting read on emo and its roots.
http://www.fourfa.com/

bleeckerx

lol damn you emopwr, i was gonna link that up for you to see!!! beat me to it- but yeah that site pretty much says it all.. good call there : )

__________________
no heros here

G0dd3ss

I'm glad someone posted that about emo. People get all freaked out b/c it's sooooo sappy. "That's not what punk rock is about". Well, yeah it's sappy. That's what it's supposed to be. It's a different kind of music.

As for the "real" punk rock, I have listened to quite a few of the greats for the last few years. Pennywise, Dropkick, The Ramones, Sex Pistol, Minor Threat, blah, blah, blah...I don't think it makes me any more cool than someone who listens to Sum 41.

Those kids like the "Pop-Punk". Some of the same guitar rifs and drum beats from punk rock, but a totally different style of music for the "skater-dress- alikes". Someday the kids who dig that sh1t now will be on their favorite forum posting about the "new style" of music that isn't as good as "theirs" was.

I think it's all a matter of generation barriers. Just my .02.

__________________
It's best not to be too moral...you cheat yourself out of too much life. - Maude, Harold and Maude.

sumredhairedguy

IMO the problem with music today (all music basicly) is the need to classify bands. music is music, but in order for music stores,radio stations, etc to sort it all out they feel the need to classify bands. do the people always agree? no. but they unless they put every damn catagory and sub catagory and mix catagory and sub mix catagory blah blah blah in there seperate shelves then we will have to just deal with it.
i have no problem with some of the "nu-punk"...if it dont want to put to much thought into what im listening to sure i'll throw on a blink cd or g.c cd..emo isnt bad,it probably shouldnt be put in the "punk" label but sometimes i dont feel like listening to loud pounding rants.
like many before me i started with bands like blink182, which for the most part i still like (older stuff especially)..from there i branched out to bands like nofx,rancid,lagwagon,misfits,social distortion..and there are still plenty for me to discover
.It does make me sick and tired however to always see people BITCHING about what they dont like in music. honestly i could care less if you dont like pop-punk-emo.thats your opinion, congrats! but it is still yours and yours alone, not mine.Listen to what YOU like and enjoy that, dont go all pissy whiny when an new found glory cd touches your ramomes cd

its been said that punk=non-conformity, so i find irony that non-confrormists have to conform to non-conformity

mystmarimatt

most of it is crap, sounds exactly alike. although as far as pop-punk goes, i kinda like Sum 41. but the worst by far is good charlotte. wouldn't have so much of a problem, if all their songs weren't so damn formulaic. give their first cd a listen. 90% of the songs follow the pattern of "(random yells of encouragement) bass only intro, little guitar bits, bass only verse, guitars during chorus, bass only verse, guuitars during chorus, bass only verse, solo, chorus, blah blah blah" i mean, the formula's not so bad in itself, but c'mon! for that many songs? it's...annoying.

__________________
Words of Wisdom:

If you could really get to know someone and know that they weren't lying to you, then you would know the world was real. Because you could agree on things, you could compare notes. That must be why people get married or make Art. So they'll be able to really know something and not go insane.

rev_skarekroe

Try the Distillers, Flogging Molly, Dragpipe... sk

__________________
"If I could have one wish, as in the fairy tales, I would unmake my past, and rise like Lazarus and stand in sunlight and banish all the dark."
D. Tibet