Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community  

Go Back   Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community > The Academy > Tilted Philosophy


 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-09-2005, 09:16 AM   #1 (permalink)
Lover - Protector - Teacher
 
Jinn's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, WA
I want some motherf***ing chocolate milk!!

I'm honestly surprised this hasn't been posted already, as it's just as bad as the raging credit-card mom of a few weeks back -- but on the other side. This mother needs to learn how to kick the shit out of her boy or maybe just throw his xBOX out the window....

It's a player called ASSASS3N playing Rainbox Six 3: Black Arrow.. he forgot to turn off his mic and a teammate recorded the whole conversation.. yeesh.

"GIVE ME SOME MOTHERFUCKING CHOCOLATE MILK BITCH!!! FUCK YOU, THIS IS BULLSHIT!"

Not really SFW because of this whiny 12 year old's swearing:

http://www.filecloud.com/files/file.php?file_id=1847

Please, fellow TFPers.. don't let your kid get like this. Teach them discipline, consequences, and individual responsibility. And kick the shit out of them if you call you a bitch.

EDIT: The site is effing stupid, so just go to the link twice.. since they require a free account I made one; username is tfp, password is tfptfp.
__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel
Jinn is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 09:39 AM   #2 (permalink)
peekaboo
 
ngdawg's Avatar
 
Location: on the back, bitch
First, that file was a bitch to get (had to search Chocolate Milk).
Now that I've heard it all I have to say is: if that was MY son talking to ME like that, he'd need some serious dental work after that first outburst(there wouldn't be a second), number one. Number two, while he was hearing all the kids talking about the latest online games, he'd be clueless because he'd never be playing another one.
A clunk on the head to that mom,too. She probably wonders why he's like that, clueless to the fact he is because she allows it. Dumbass.....
__________________
Don't blame me. I didn't vote for either of'em.
ngdawg is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 09:57 AM   #3 (permalink)
Lover - Protector - Teacher
 
Jinn's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, WA
I'm glad you at least were able to see the video. That host is worthless, but every site on the web covering it seems to link back to that same address. If you've logged into the site, then use THIS http://www.filecloud.com/files/searc...chocolate+milk link and click the first hit. I think. Awww bugger..
__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel
Jinn is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 10:59 AM   #4 (permalink)
 
StanT's Avatar
 
Location: Colorado
The file is painful to get and even more painful to listen to.

A similar conversation at my house wouldn't have lasted 3:29 minutes. The one and only time my oldest talked to my wife like that, she also took a swing at her. Said daughter hit the refrigerator a foot off the ground and left a nifty dent as a reminder.

While I don't advocate violence, it would have been the response to this kid.
StanT is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 03:14 PM   #5 (permalink)
...is a comical chap
 
Grasshopper Green's Avatar
 
Location: Where morons reign supreme
Ya, the file was a pain in the butt to get to.

Wow...I can't believe someone would let their kid talk to them that way. My brother called my mom a bitch once...and got knocked across the head with the broom handle. To my knowledge, he never did it again while living under my parents roof. My parents didn't tolerate that kind of disrespect...and I won't tolerate that with my son. I wonder if the mom ever got him his chocolate milk
__________________
"They say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings; steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king"

Formerly Medusa
Grasshopper Green is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 03:41 PM   #6 (permalink)
People in masks cannot be trusted
 
Xazy's Avatar
 
Location: NYC
My wife and I discuss about spanking or not to spank (she is a therapist that deals with kids), and feels that spanking is not needed (need the 100K education to be worth something). But I feel there are times that a kid needs a good spank!

I grew up got spanked 3 times that I can recall, and a kid needs to learn respect!!
Xazy is offline  
Old 08-09-2005, 04:36 PM   #7 (permalink)
Addict
 
Location: Amish-land, PA
It's hard to tell, just by the incident itself, what the background story to this is.

Perhaps, the mother and father speak like sailors around the house (no offense to seamen). On the otherhand, perhaps the kid watches too much of The Sopranos.

This all stems back to a lack of discipline in the past. No kid just starts like that out of the blue. He first starts at a lesser stage and gradually builds up a lack of respect and an acceptance of coarse language. Now I'm no angel of language myself, but I know when to control it and when to let it fly (note: how I speak around my friends is not the same as around my co-workers, which is not the same as around my family). This kid just needs to learn some respect. But then again, the parents should never have let him get away with it the first time.
__________________
"I've made only one mistake in my life. But I made it over and over and over. That was saying 'yes' when I meant 'no'. Forgive me."
TM875 is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 11:25 AM   #8 (permalink)
Omnipotent Ruler Of The Tiny Universe In My Mind
 
mystmarimatt's Avatar
 
Location: Oreegawn
Oh my God...If I ever talked to my Mom that way (not that I EVER would), my Dad would easily rip out my throat within ten seconds.

He needs a good lesson in discipline. I've no idea how to administer it, of course, but...He definitely needs an attitude readjustment. And a lesson in logic. Her choosing not to bring him his drink when he starts to bitch her out isn't 'lying.'

I can see what he's going to grow up in to. I knew assholes like him in high school.

That was insane.
__________________
Words of Wisdom:

If you could really get to know someone and know that they weren't lying to you, then you would know the world was real. Because you could agree on things, you could compare notes. That must be why people get married or make Art. So they'll be able to really know something and not go insane.
mystmarimatt is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 11:46 AM   #9 (permalink)
Pissing in the cornflakes
 
Ustwo's Avatar
 
Hmmmmmm

Few weeks ago we get psycho mom recording....

Now we get psycho child.....

I'm sure that its just a coincidence.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.
Ustwo is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 12:14 PM   #10 (permalink)
Hey Now!
 
Johnny Pyro's Avatar
 
Location: Massachusetts (Redneck, white boy town. I hate it here.)
Wow. That kid has to be spoiled. Man, I could never say that to my mom, not that I would, my mom would of killed me. When I was growing up my mother never put up with my shit. Even a little attitude, I would get slapped in the mouth. I have nightmares about the wooden spoon. Ahhhh! the wooden spoon! My mom is old school.

I love and respect my mommy.
__________________
"From delusion lead me to truth, from darkness lead me to light, from death lead me to eternal life. - Sheriff John Wydell
Johnny Pyro is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 01:07 PM   #11 (permalink)
Junkie
 
Moderator Emeritus
Location: Chicago
One of the many times I got my mouth washed out with soap, was for telling my brother he smelled like a fart... (he did... really...) I could just imagine what would be inflicted upon me for using such language at my mother and such blatant disprespect.

I couldnt hear a lot of the mom at the beginning, but she sounded like she was not being all that nice to the kid... so I think the kid is definitely a product of his environment. He wouldn't survie 10 minutes with Sister Mary Richard from when I was in first grade...
__________________
Free your heart from hatred. Free your mind from worries. Live simply. Give more. Expect less.
maleficent is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 05:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
Getting Clearer
 
Seeker's Avatar
 
Location: with spirit
Respect is something that needs to be installed from early childhood... even back to infancy. If you treat the child with respect they will learn respect. As they grow they will push boundaries and need to learn where those boundaries are. Again, if you show the child respectfully you won't have too many dramas.

There was one time my daughter gave me some serious 'attitude' ... I grabbed her by the throat and slammed her against the wall, punched the wall beside her head and bellowed (in a low tone, not that fish-wife thing) that I would not tolerate that sort of treatment. She shat herself! (She was never in danger of being hurt... I was after the 'shock' factor...) That was two years ago, I have not had that problem again.

She did however bring up that she could report me for child abuse... I just told her to look over her whole existance with me, and if she wished to live with someone else she would be quite welcome to report me. She decided against it

I have no idea what you can do with a child that has come so far as in the recording... the only chance would be for the whole family to attend counselling and change the whole dynamic in the household... what would be the chances of that happening, and how often would that happen this far down the track (the boy is 12, my daughters age)... *sigh* It's so sad and very scarey...
__________________
To those who wander but who are not lost...

~ Knowledge is not something you acquire, it is something you open yourself to.
Seeker is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 06:33 PM   #13 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Good lord. The kid mouths off to mom and you guys are advocating beating the hell out of him.
Quote:
hit the refrigerator a foot off the ground and left a nifty dent as a reminder
That's called child abuse. You should have been jailed.

We do not do our children any favors by teaching them that violence is wrong unless someone calls you a name. My kid called my wife a fucking whore once. He'll never do it again, and I didn't have to maul him to get that result. Stripping his room of everything but a mattress and a topsheet for six months, and making him my wife's slave for the same time period cured that, and we got a great garden planted out of it, and I didn't have to bust one rock to do it.

If you can't control yourself well enough to avoid slamming your daughter into appliances or wailing on your kid with a broom handle you need therapy.
shakran is offline  
Old 08-10-2005, 06:55 PM   #14 (permalink)
... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.
 
Willravel's Avatar
 
Maybe 'chocolate milk' is actually...the antidote.
Willravel is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 06:32 AM   #15 (permalink)
...is a comical chap
 
Grasshopper Green's Avatar
 
Location: Where morons reign supreme
edit: regaining my perspective.
__________________
"They say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings; steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king"

Formerly Medusa

Last edited by Grasshopper Green; 08-11-2005 at 06:42 AM..
Grasshopper Green is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 08:17 AM   #16 (permalink)
 
StanT's Avatar
 
Location: Colorado
Quote:
Originally Posted by shakran
Good lord. The kid mouths off to mom and you guys are advocating beating the hell out of him.

Quote:
hit the refrigerator a foot off the ground and left a nifty dent as a reminder
That's called child abuse. You should have been jailed.

We do not do our children any favors by teaching them that violence is wrong unless someone calls you a name. My kid called my wife a fucking whore once. He'll never do it again, and I didn't have to maul him to get that result. Stripping his room of everything but a mattress and a topsheet for six months, and making him my wife's slave for the same time period cured that, and we got a great garden planted out of it, and I didn't have to bust one rock to do it.

If you can't control yourself well enough to avoid slamming your daughter into appliances or wailing on your kid with a broom handle you need therapy.

Quote:
The one and only time my oldest talked to my wife like that, she also took a swing at her.
You neglected to include the part where my daughter took a swing at my wife. While I'm not particularly easy to provoke, that's a pretty sure way to do it. My daughter was never in any danger, I was looking to make a very strong impression on a 15 year. It worked.

My daughter is now 25 and reasonably well adjusted. Parenting is a learn as you go proposition, slamming her into a refrigerator may not have been the best solution, but reasoning with her at 15, obviously wasn't working either. I was and am still willing to take my chances with DCFS.
StanT is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 08:56 AM   #17 (permalink)
Pissing in the cornflakes
 
Ustwo's Avatar
 
I am a firm believer in spare the rod spoil the child

I was spanked once as a child. Only once. Did wonders.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.
Ustwo is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:26 AM   #18 (permalink)
Betitled
 
It's quite sad that so many people in this thread advocate violence, especially toward children. The only situation where hitting a child is acceptable is when the child assaults someone else physically and self-defence is in order. Even then, the violence should be kept to a minimum and stopped when the child is calmed down/restrained. In any other case, such as this, there should be a stiff non-physical punishment.

I don't think I could love or even respect someone who hit me to discipline me. If violence makes a parent feel more proactive, then perhaps the parent should really consider not haivng any more kids.

No, I do not have children. And I am not a hippie, I swear.

Last edited by Glava; 08-11-2005 at 09:33 AM..
Glava is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:35 AM   #19 (permalink)
Junkie
 
Moderator Emeritus
Location: Chicago
I personally don't think there is anything wrong with spanking a child... Cause and effect is learned early-- child does something wrong - there are consequences... If that consequence is a swat on the fanny then so be it... i don't think that smacking a kid til they are black and blue is effective but consequenses are important. it's something adults deal with every single day... Your behavior has a consequence, bad behavior has different consequences.

This child has never been taught consequences, he's been catered to and probably spoiled rotten, i couldn't quite tell what momma's problem was but she clearly wasn't parent of the year material. I'm not sure that she ever learned consequences either -- because otherwise she wouldn't be in the position with her child t hat she is now - -basically (opinion formed from a 3 minute recording) he is a child she does not know
how to control.
__________________
Free your heart from hatred. Free your mind from worries. Live simply. Give more. Expect less.
maleficent is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:45 AM   #20 (permalink)
Submit to me, you know you want to
 
ShaniFaye's Avatar
 
Location: Lilburn, Ga
Its peoples attitudes, such as the ones that say spanking is child abuse, its sad that parents think they have to resort to "violence" toward their children, that fact that in this day and age a child can report their parents for child abuse because they got spanked that probably got this mother and son where they are in the first place.

There is a HUGE difference between spanking a child and abusing a child. There is a HUGE difference between "violence" towards a child and swatting their butt a few times.

Whether people like it or not, there ARE times, and YES I AM a parent, when thats the only thing that works/gets their attention.

/will not say anything else...I've posted in the several threads on this topic and it fires me up to much to be nice to the people who rag on parents that spank.
__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!
ShaniFaye is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:45 AM   #21 (permalink)
Betitled
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by maleficent
I personally don't think there is anything wrong with spanking a child... Cause and effect is learned early-- child does something wrong - there are consequences... If that consequence is a swat on the fanny then so be it... i don't think that smacking a kid til they are black and blue is effective but consequenses are important. it's something adults deal with every single day... Your behavior has a consequence, bad behavior has different consequences.
There should definitely be a consequence, but not one that makes a child fear his parents. If you behave badly when you are an adult, would an authority figure strike you? No. There would still be a consequence, but a non-violent one (assuming that criminality is not involved). So why should we make kids think that they will get hit if they mess up?
Glava is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:53 AM   #22 (permalink)
Junkie
 
Moderator Emeritus
Location: Chicago
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glava
There should definitely be a consequence, but not one that makes a child fear his parents. If you behave badly when you are an adult, would an authority figure strike you? No. There would still be a consequence, but a non-violent one (assuming that criminality is not involved). So why should we make kids think that they will get hit if they mess up?
A younger child is not always going to understand that if he does something bad and has to go sit in the corner for 2 hours, with their attention span, after the first hour they aren't going to remember why they are in the corner, they will hopefully remember, that if i do X, mommy swatted my butt to get my attention - and I won't do it again because I didn't like it.

A swat is immediate, and it gets their attention...
__________________
Free your heart from hatred. Free your mind from worries. Live simply. Give more. Expect less.
maleficent is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:56 AM   #23 (permalink)
will always be an Alyson Hanniganite
 
Bill O'Rights's Avatar
 
Location: In the dust of the archives
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glava
There should definitely be a consequence, but not one that makes a child fear his parents.
There is a big difference between a spanking, which my children have gotten, and back handing a kid alongside her face, which I have never done. The former, I believe, instills boundaries and respect, while the latter instills the fear that you mention. One is discipline, the other is abuse. The two are not synonomous.
__________________
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.
Bill O'Rights is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:59 AM   #24 (permalink)
Kick Ass Kunoichi
 
snowy's Avatar
 
Location: Oregon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glava
There should definitely be a consequence, but not one that makes a child fear his parents. If you behave badly when you are an adult, would an authority figure strike you? No. There would still be a consequence, but a non-violent one (assuming that criminality is not involved). So why should we make kids think that they will get hit if they mess up?
As a child who was spanked, I can tell you that I never, ever feared my parents--well, except when I did something bad and I KNEW what the consequence was for it. If Mom was going for the wooden spoon, oh boy, I musta done something really, really bad this time. And yes, the punishment changed as I got older--I certainly didn't get spanked after the age of 10. People overestimate what young children understand when it comes to punishment and consequence, and so keeping it black and white with corporal punishment is effective. It may not be the best method, but it's the one that most easily translates consequence to the child.

Another problem is that when parents attempt to punish children using non-violent methods, they use methods that are not effective. Sending a child to his room is a joke--most kids' rooms these days have everything they want in them. Parents also seem to have a harder time taking away privileges.

I think our society has become overly paranoid of spanking.
__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau
snowy is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 11:07 AM   #25 (permalink)
Insane
 
astrahl's Avatar
 
Location: You don't want to live here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glava
It's quite sad that so many people in this thread advocate violence, especially toward children. The only situation where hitting a child is acceptable is when the child assaults someone else physically and self-defence is in order. Even then, the violence should be kept to a minimum and stopped when the child is calmed down/restrained. In any other case, such as this, there should be a stiff non-physical punishment.

I don't think I could love or even respect someone who hit me to discipline me. If violence makes a parent feel more proactive, then perhaps the parent should really consider not haivng any more kids.

No, I do not have children. And I am not a hippie, I swear.
I think you are confusing the word violence with discipline. These people aren't talking about hitting children with bats or fists or a bag of kittens. A swat on the butt is not violence. I got the belt as a kid when I was at my worst - which, funny, NEVER HAPPENED AGAIN.

I think this time-out bullshit has led to the, lack of a better word, pussification of kids. They are more smart-mouthy than I think we were. The use of physical disciplining is like drugs, what works for you and your kids may not work for somebody else.

And for the one who said he shoulda been put in jail for the fridge dent incident. OMFG - You are the type of person who has helped make parents impotent to misbehaving kids in public when said kids really deserve a wack.
__________________
Maybe it was over when she chucked me out the Rover at full speed.
Maybe Maybe...
~a-Ha

Last edited by astrahl; 08-11-2005 at 11:13 AM..
astrahl is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 11:07 AM   #26 (permalink)
Rail Baron
 
stevo's Avatar
 
Location: Tallyfla
So I'm still downloading this file, why the hell is it 41.7MB?

My mom broke countless wooden spoons on our behinds, to this day she doesn't have any in her house. But I can't blame her - 4 boys would drive anyone to the spoon. As far as this kid is concerned, I don't really have to listen to the file to know whats wrong. I think that family could use some nanny911 treatment.
__________________
"If I am such a genius why am I drunk, lost in the desert, with a bullet in my ass?" -Otto Mannkusser
stevo is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 11:14 AM   #27 (permalink)
Pissing in the cornflakes
 
Ustwo's Avatar
 
Pain is a wonderful tool that has evolved over 4 billion years to tell us not to do certain things.

It would be a shame to ignore such a great learning tool in order to fit the feel good sensibilities of the hippie generation. The reason why so many of us Gen Xers are bringing back things like spanking, as we saw what the alternative is in our friends or our selves in our upbringing.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.
Ustwo is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 01:43 PM   #28 (permalink)
...is a comical chap
 
Grasshopper Green's Avatar
 
Location: Where morons reign supreme
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ustwo
Pain is a wonderful tool that has evolved over 4 billion years to tell us not to do certain things.

It would be a shame to ignore such a great learning tool in order to fit the feel good sensibilities of the hippie generation. The reason why so many of us Gen Xers are bringing back things like spanking, as we saw what the alternative is in our friends or our selves in our upbringing.
Thank you, Ustwo. I couldn't have put it better myself.

Time to come out of the closet....I'm a spanker. No, I don't abuse my child, he only gets it when he really needs it. Time outs are usually sufficient for him. I was spanked as a child and never feared my parents...until I knew I did something I wasn't supposed to. I only remember being spanked twice as a child; I was a fast learner. I watch my stepsister as she raises her child, using only time outs and such, and that child is the biggest brat I have ever had the misfortune to run across. She really needs a few whacks to the butt.

Now, I also feel I have to defend my mother, as per my previous post. She wasn't "wailing" on my brother; he was nearly a foot taller and while he may not have outweighed her, he was pure muscle and she wasn't. He was being threatening towards her, but only when the verbal insult came out did the broom fly...and only once. I guess it would have been better for him to hit or strike her instead of her disciplining her child
__________________
"They say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings; steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king"

Formerly Medusa
Grasshopper Green is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 04:36 PM   #29 (permalink)
Getting Clearer
 
Seeker's Avatar
 
Location: with spirit
Why does a physical discipline imply child abuse? Honestly I think a lack of thought and care on the parents behalf is just as much a "child abuse" case as a parent that beats on their child... and what about emotional abuse?

I can count on one hand the amount of times I have been physical with my child, and she is twelve. I'd say that is a damn good effort on my part.

My child understands that she gets a reaction from me only when she has pushed things way too far... she has learnt that her actions have consequences. I am like any other person she will come across in life and if you are disrespectful toward them, you need to consider what that person may do about it. Options from being disliked through to copping a punch... that is dependant on where the person you are disrespecting is at. She is also aware that this depends greatly on other factors that are happening within an individuals life, they may be having a bad day, week... whatever! You always need to consider another.

This teaching has nothing to do with the fact that I have been physical with her in the past... this is a care factor and she has had a learning. My daughter is very aware that my physical discipline has only been equated with my "care factor".
__________________
To those who wander but who are not lost...

~ Knowledge is not something you acquire, it is something you open yourself to.
Seeker is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 04:42 PM   #30 (permalink)
Submit to me, you know you want to
 
ShaniFaye's Avatar
 
Location: Lilburn, Ga
I finally listened to this thing...had that been my child the computer would have been shut off and taken away the 2nd time I had to tell my child to turn it down....If my child talked to me like that, she'd be re enacting the lifeboy soap scene from A Christmas Story.
__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!
ShaniFaye is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 04:44 PM   #31 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanT
You neglected to include the part where my daughter took a swing at my wife.

Because it was irrelevant. First, unless you neglected to include something the swing did not connect, and you did not mention anything about any follow up swings from your daughter. In other words, when you hurled your daughter into the fridge, your wife wasn't being attacked. Plus, from the way you described it, your actions were not to defend your wife, but to punish your child for attacking your wife. There's a big difference. Finally, if you're gonna sit there and tell me that a fully grown man has ONLY the option of hurling his 15 year old daughter into an appliance to defend people, then I think you're just proving my initial point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. O'Rights
There is a big difference between a spanking, which my children have gotten, and back handing a kid alongside her face, which I have never done. The former, I believe, instills boundaries and respect, while the latter instills the fear that you mention. One is discipline, the other is abuse. The two are not synonomous.
Sounds like a lot of justifying for what is essentially the same act. I've taught my child not to hit anyone unless he is in physical danger and fighting is the only way out. I did not teach him "don't hit anyone unless a) you do it with the palm of your hand rather than the back , b) you do it from the back of the guy you're hitting instead of the front and c) you really want to.

We cannot sit there and tell our kids that hitting is wrong and then hit them when they do something which displeases us. Aside from the opinion that hitting the child is wrong no matter what, we are introducing a logical inconsistancy.

And to those saying the kid doesn't understand any punishment after an hour because of the attention span, but will understand the spanking, well that logic just doesn't bear out. Either the kid has a suitable attention span to remember what he did wrong or he does not. If he does not, then it doesn't matter if I put him in a corner OR I hit him, either way, he's not gonna remember why tomorrow. Besides, I don't buy the attention span stuff. Kids remember endless strings of seemingly random cheat codes for every game they play, yet they won't remember why misbehaving is bad? C'mon!

You can justify spanking all you want, but when you get right down to it there are plenty of punishments that are just as effective as spanking - the only downside is that they all take more parental work than spanking does. Spanking is very very easy. Whack the kid and you're done. Other punishments require follow through on the part of the parent, and most parents simply aren't willing to invest that kind of effort into the punishment.

And I stand by my initial opinion that throwing your kid into appliances or hitting them with sticks, or any other form of violence of that nature IS child abuse, and you SHOULD lose the kid and go to jail.
shakran is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 05:03 PM   #32 (permalink)
 
StanT's Avatar
 
Location: Colorado
Quote:
Originally Posted by shakran
And I stand by my initial opinion that throwing your kid into appliances or hitting them with sticks, or any other form of violence of that nature IS child abuse, and you SHOULD lose the kid and go to jail.
And I'll take the stand that your approach leads to kids that behave like the example given.
StanT is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 05:20 PM   #33 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanT
And I'll take the stand that your approach leads to kids that behave like the example given.

Well, mine doesn't, so I figure I must've done something right.

You're way too either-or about this. Either we beat the crap out of the kid or we don't have ANY discipline. There is a middle ground. Unfortunately for many abused children, many people never find it, and beat their kids instead. And no, guys, I'm not talking spankings here. There's a big difference between spanking (I still don't like it) and throwing the kid into a fridge hard enough to dent it. That's child abuse, plain and simple, and if you think you have to abuse a kid in order to get the kid to behave right, then you desperately need therapy.
shakran is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 05:47 PM   #34 (permalink)
 
StanT's Avatar
 
Location: Colorado
And I feel that you are the one that sees this as black and white.

Different kids require different approaches. If one technique doesn't work, then you try another. The approach you suggest worked for the most part with my youngest daughter, it did not faze my oldest in the slightest. I refused to give up on my daughter, I'd rather take my chances with DCFS than raise a kid like the example above.

My kids are 24 and 25, educated, employed, and seemingly well adjusted in spite of their "abuse". I guess I must have done something right, as well.

Don't read too much into denting a refrigerator, it isn't that hard to do.
StanT is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 06:33 PM   #35 (permalink)
We work alone
 
LoganSnake's Avatar
 
Location: Cake Town
I am not a violent person, nor are my parents. If I were to mouth off like that (which, I never would because I was actually brought up right), I don't think I would have some of my teeth and would have problem seeing for a while. Respect is instilled into a child at an early age by any means necessary. I was brought up in a Russian family. If any of you are familiar with Russian customs, you know that respect is one of the most demanding things in the family. I would not even have to mouth off like that; I will easily get slapped, right now at the age of 19 if I so much as raise my voice at my parents. That is all it will take. I can't recall the last time my parents hit me. They taught me good values since birth and there was never need for physical abuse.

That is not to say I don't respect the parenting skills of those who have expressed their opinion, but I side with those that show the kids who the boss is. Be it slamming them against the wall, into the refrigerator, or hitting them with the broom. I will respect my children, and I would expect them to respect me. I will resort to physical punishment without thinking twice.
__________________
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing that you'll be an idiot in the future. Common sense is knowing that you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
LoganSnake is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 06:53 PM   #36 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoganSnake
but I side with those that show the kids who the boss is. Be it slamming them against the wall, into the refrigerator, or hitting them with the broom.

Then you side with child abuse. Easy as that.
shakran is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 07:01 PM   #37 (permalink)
We work alone
 
LoganSnake's Avatar
 
Location: Cake Town
Hitting your kids for amusement and slapping them once because they don't respect you are two different things. I am not for child abuse. If I would give my heart and soul to my kid, respecting him, loving him and he comes out and calls me an asshole? Oh, you bet your ass he'll be getting his. And how.
__________________
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing that you'll be an idiot in the future. Common sense is knowing that you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
LoganSnake is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 07:18 PM   #38 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoganSnake
Hitting your kids for amusement and slapping them once because they don't respect you are two different things. I am not for child abuse. If I would give my heart and soul to my kid, respecting him, loving him and he comes out and calls me an asshole? Oh, you bet your ass he'll be getting his. And how.

Oh I get it. It's only abuse if you think it's funny. Sorry, doesn't work that way. You whack your kid with a broom, it's child abuse. Doesn't matter what the reason is. There's no two ways about it. You're supporting child abuse.

Look at it this way. If you hit someone with a broom handle on the street, you'll get arrested and charged with felony assault. What makes you think the same action is ok, or even legal just because you're doing it to your underage child? That's absurd.
shakran is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 07:54 PM   #39 (permalink)
Pissing in the cornflakes
 
Ustwo's Avatar
 
shakran is it ok if I use my bare hand?

My mother is only 5'2", at some point (I was maybe 9 or 10) I did something wrong and my mother slapped me. I stared her down, she was too weak to hurt me.

Then my father came home.

Oddly my mother didn't have to worry about me being a problem after that.

One spanking (and it hurt like hell) fixed what no time out would have ever done.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.
Ustwo is offline  
Old 08-11-2005, 08:08 PM   #40 (permalink)
Tone.
 
shakran's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ustwo
shakran is it ok if I use my bare hand?

I don't think it's necessary but I'm not gonna foam at the mouth and call child protection over it. I still think it sends the wrong message. "When people displease you, you should hit them." That's not the message I want to impart to my child.

And all the examples on here about "I got spanked and straightened right the hell up" are great, but just because one method gets a desired result does not mean it's the only method, nor does it mean it's the best.

As I mentioned earlier, I too had an issue with my kid mouthing off to his mom. I didn't lay a hand on him, but I stripped his room completely bare except for his mattress. I even put his dresser in our room. He had to come to us to get his clothes. He also had to do every chore my wife wanted him to do, above and beyond his normal chores. He didn't have ANY free time for 6 months, and he ended up digging a big damn garden (nice rocky soil too). In short I made his life a living hell for months on end because of his stupidity. That was several years ago now and the kid's NEVER done anything like that again. I too taught him respect and I didn't have to lay a hand on him. The main physical consequence to his punishment was that he developed his muscles.

I have never found it necessary to spank my kid.

But regardless of what our opinions on spanking are, it is still without question wrong to commit child abuse. If you hit your kid with an object, or throw your kid into something, you are abusing your kid.
shakran is offline  
 

Tags
chocolate, milk, motherfing

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:14 AM.

Tilted Forum Project

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
© 2002-2012 Tilted Forum Project

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360