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Old 01-17-2006, 11:31 AM   #1 (permalink)
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abstract "Now" is faster than light

Hi, I'm New.
This is one thing on my mind-
can anyone add to it?

We are all witnesses to some sort of phenomina I'm calling "absolute now"

Imagine the effects of a bullet shooting through the air- How the air moves -How air behind the bullet gets sucked into it's draft, and How the air spins in "backwater" behind the bullet.

In this picture, we are like particles of dust. The bullet could be named several things but is one idea- "Absolute Now" "Life" "Spirit" "The Kingdom of Heaven" or "Jesus" (if you have no faith in the last two,[or any] that's fine, but the point is for me to say what I mean)

We can understand the bullet because we can compare our lives with it's "hyperlink" organization to our parents' modern organization. You have to let go of "cutting edge" ego continuely maintain "cutting edge." It's kind of like The Lion the witch, and the waredrobe- How the witch froze people exactly how they were- their life was frozen to the real life around them.
Life moves, and we are always behind it. We, as the particles of dust, are never part of the "now bullet" we are just affected by it. Some, caught in the bullet's draft, some caught swirling in aftermath, some only slightly affected.... In any case, each is still behind the bullet. We only have *Hope* to "be on the ball" er... bullet....
see, it's not a new idea. My grandpa says the phrase "get on the ball." And I've witnessed this in a lot of writers, movies, and ways.

Does this stir up any goodness?
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Old 01-22-2006, 05:59 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindGillsPlease
Life moves, and we are always behind it. We, as the particles of dust, are never part of the "now bullet" we are just affected by it. Some, caught in the bullet's draft, some caught swirling in aftermath, some only slightly affected.... In any case, each is still behind the bullet. We only have *Hope* to "be on the ball" er... bullet....
Your life is what you make of it. You have control. Too many people are content to settle with their lot in life, to think that they're merely "particles of dust," as you say, at the mercy of the world. Why not be the "bullet" instead?
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Old 01-24-2006, 12:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I don't think you can be the bullet like that. it's not competative; "there can be only one" Nor is it fatalistic, at the whim of the world: "sometimes you are the bug, sometimes the windsheild"

What I say is that life and God are outside of what we call the "world." and we can't therefore, subject to either the world, or ourselves, keep up. There is more to Life then us.

God moves in the spiritual realm, and we are forced to play out the details within the framework phyiscal laws. This Sharade takes time, and has lag. True Life remains before us, just as all light takes time to reach our eyes.

Yet, if God promises us spiritual birth through his Son, then we can hope to keep in step with the Spirit of God in our new spirit, reguardless of the lag of our bodies are subject to.

so, I think it's possible to be with the bullet as co-creators with God. But we can not claim the bullet or we haven't understood it.

Maybe the metaphor would work better if I didn't use the imagery of a conquestish violent bullet.
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Old 01-24-2006, 03:38 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I'm not sure I get the bullet analogy - but 'now', is always going to be too late, for a number of reasons.
1) It takes a finite amount of time for an event to effect us.
2) It takes a little longer for our chemical/electrical biology to have any awareness of such effects.
Since it takes time for us to become aware of anything, and even longer to respond, we are always living a tiny bit behind the 'now' and, unless we have powers of prediction (which we do - i.e. in the case of catching a ball) we'll forever be missing out on what's actually going on.
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Old 01-24-2006, 08:59 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I don't know, maybe you don't need to get the bullet analogy.
What you said, nezmot, is along the lines of what I mean. It might make more sense to take that thought, (how one person has delay in perceiving and responding) And instead pretend all of humanity is one body, expanding on your thoughts from one individual to many. Groups of humans at least. These groups have the same lag. Even if a few individuals might become aware of something, the rest of the group hasn't precieved, or responded to it yet.
One question might be, How complex is this lag in organizations of humanity?
Take the playing out of western culture, for example. Socrates or Plato's Ideas are still trickling through how we govern today. We are still becoming aware of different implications of how Plato's words translate to us, and therefore, we build off of them. Sometimes we lose the meaning because we never understood, sometimes the meaning is refined through our understanding. How do we know we might have lost the meaning? I know western culture is based off plato, but I couldn't separate out the plato from the nonplato policies to anyone. Jesus lived 500 years after them. It's just shocking to think about how growth happens. On the one hand, Ideas may travel around the globe, but on the other, people might not yet really even understand what the ideas completely MEANT. How far, how long does this lag in meaning go?

To tie this to my other post, God may move through Nebcanezzar, Socrates, Jesus, Martin Luther King, or whoever, But He was there, and now He's gone on. We're looking at God's back, where he just was, and trying to find a story. As glorious as that is, can we hope to keep in step with the Living God?
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Old 01-25-2006, 09:24 AM   #6 (permalink)
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It sounds like you're trying to justify fate and/or God with an analogy that doesn't seem to apply to my life, so I've really got nothing to say in response, other than:

Rule your own life by setting your own path through it. And most importantly, follow that path.
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Old 01-25-2006, 09:39 AM   #7 (permalink)
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On second though, I re-read your post and was a little disturbed by your unncessary imagery.. so I've decided to post a proper comment--

Quote:
We are all witnesses to some sort of phenomina I'm calling "absolute now"
What evidence to you have to justify this statement?


Quote:

abstract "Now" is faster than light
Hi, I'm New.
This is one thing on my mind-
can anyone add to it?

We are all witnesses to some sort of phenomina I'm calling "absolute now"

Imagine the effects of a bullet shooting through the air- How the air moves -How air behind the bullet gets sucked into it's draft, and How the air spins in "backwater" behind the bullet.

In this picture, we are like particles of dust.
I'm not sure I see how this is connected. I'm imagining a bullet and the spinning/sucking physics created by rifling. How does this then become an analogy to us and dust? Are we bullets flying through the air? Or are we particles of dust?

Quote:
We can understand the bullet because we can compare our lives with it's "hyperlink" organization to our parents' modern organization
How do bullets have anything to do with hyperlinks, or contemporary society's organization? I think you need to explain this metaphor much more clearly. Furthermore, what is it about this bullet that we're understanding?

Quote:
You have to let go of "cutting edge" ego continuely maintain "cutting edge."
This sentence doesn't really follow nor does it stand alone as an idea.

Quote:
We, as the particles of dust, are never part of the "now bullet" we are just affected by it. Some, caught in the bullet's draft, some caught swirling in aftermath, some only slightly affected.... In any case, each is still behind the bullet. We only have *Hope* to "be on the ball" er... bullet...
Okay, so, if I understand the metaphor correctly now; We are particles of dust floating around, and events are speeding away from us (ala the bullet). The bullet's "draft" is sucking us towards it (from our surroundings) and speeding us up, but we'll never match the velocity of the bullet? I can understand this philosophy, but I don't know how this follows:

Quote:
I don't think you can be the bullet like that. it's not competative; "there can be only one" Nor is it fatalistic, at the whim of the world: "sometimes you are the bug, sometimes the windsheild"
Why don't you think we can be the bullet? I don't think you've clearly identified a reason why (in your metaphor) we cannot be the bullet (or the metal contained within the bullet, should you care to elaborate it that way).

Quote:
What I say is that life and God are outside of what we call the "world." and we can't therefore, subject to either the world, or ourselves, keep up. There is more to Life then us.
So God is the bullet?

Quote:
Yet, if God promises us spiritual birth through his Son, then we can hope to keep in step with the Spirit of God in our new spirit, reguardless of the lag of our bodies are subject to.
Why? Since your metaphor relies on a bullet under the influence of physical properties, what would allow us to suddenly accelerate from the from the windstream of a bullet to the velocity of the bullet itself? It sounds like you're trying to fit God into a perfectly apt philosophical metaphor about travelling slower than the World does.

Quote:
Take the playing out of western culture, for example. Socrates or Plato's Ideas are still trickling through how we govern today.
Example?

Quote:
We are still becoming aware of different implications of how Plato's words translate to us, and therefore, we build off of them. Sometimes we lose the meaning because we never understood, sometimes the meaning is refined through our understanding. How do we know we might have lost the meaning? I know western culture is based off plato, but I couldn't separate out the plato from the nonplato policies to anyone.
Experience is the culmination of the things past and present, so its only understandable that a man in our past shapes our present.

Quote:
To tie this to my other post, God may move through Nebcanezzar, Socrates, Jesus, Martin Luther King, or whoever, But He was there, and now He's gone on.
Why does this necessitate a God?

I really don't understand why there needs to be a God in any of these metaphors. While interesting philosophically, you don't seem to be connecting nor justifying why God is essential in this situation.

I suppose if I believed in a God (per your prerequisite I shouldn't have to) I could just say "Yea, that works.." but I don't believe you've clearly elucidated it for those of us who do not.
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Old 01-25-2006, 11:49 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I'M a little disturbed by my excessive imagery! If it didn't work for you, you were right in your first post to leave it alone. Leave the offense of nonsense to the nonsensical. Though I do thank you, jinnkai, for your questions, I hope you understand I can't answer each one of them.

For you, the bullet( for fun, let's change it to a photon [no rifling]) is "absolute now" or "Life." It's faster then you and your friends clustered around a nucleus of something. It wizzes past you. Are you changed? Did you miss it? Did it, under phyical laws still affect you, in whatever small way it may be? That is how we are all witnesses. Evidence of us being changed is seen in one way from societal growth. The cutting edge organization of the modern age fit our limitations of travel and communication. The cutting edge organization of the information age fits our freedom to communicate from anywhere, to any age group, of any peoples who have access to such freedom. It might seem like acceleration, but it is actually drag from the our photon, which has more mass, drawing us to itself.

Why does this nessisate God?
I believe God is Life, that He is the Living God. You can believe in Life too, without religous baggage if you want. However, if your denyal of God led you away from the truths of life, that would be foolish. No one can eluidate by what isn't true.
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