Points for each one you find.... and avoid. - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

2wolves · 11-06-2003, 07:29 AM

http://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.php

Full list with more links available at above URL.

Fallacies of Distraction

False Dilemma: two choices are given when in fact there are three options

From Ignorance: because something is not known to be true, it is assumed to be false

Slippery Slope: a series of increasingly unacceptable consequences is drawn

Complex Question: two unrelated points are conjoined as a single proposition

Appeals to Motives in Place of Support

Appeal to Force: the reader is persuaded to agree by force

Appeal to Pity: the reader is persuaded to agree by sympathy

Consequences: the reader is warned of unacceptable consequences

Prejudicial Language: value or moral goodness is attached to believing the author

Popularity: a proposition is argued to be true because it is widely held to be true

Changing the Subject

Attacking the Person:

the person's character is attacked

the person's circumstances are noted

the person does not practise what is preached

filtherton · 11-06-2003, 07:45 AM

Maybe we could come up with icons, similar to the smileys to put after a quote to point out one of these fallacies. We could have a key, with a specific icon for a specific fallacy.

Conclamo Ludus · 11-06-2003, 08:44 AM

I think you'd be hardpressed to find any post on this board that doesn't fall into one of these. Interesting stuff though. Is there a fallacy that dismisses an argument because it is a fallacy?

eple · 11-06-2003, 11:32 AM

Heh, I really wonder if it is possible to discuss at all without breaking a few of these rules. The icon thingie was a good idea filtherton, but they might get a disturbance too, as people would start debating the use of the icons, instead of focussing on the real issue...

Conclamo Ludus · 11-06-2003, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by eple
Heh, I really wonder if it is possible to discuss at all without breaking a few of these rules. The icon thingie was a good idea filtherton, but they might get a disturbance too, as people would start debating the use of the icons, instead of focussing on the real issue...

This is what I'm afraid of too. I'd hate to see every other response be laden with icons and be used as a way of scoring points on eachother. There must be a fallacy of arguing fallacy. It may really deter from good old-fashioned discussion. I'm glad 2wolves is posting these though. Those that wish to learn more about debate can check these out and be careful to try not use them or to recognize them. Some will probably come here, check them out, and then point fingers and high-five themselves every time they see them. This wouldn't be a very effective use. Probably the most effective use would be to trap someone in their own argument through these, while never even letting on that you know anything about fallacies or which one they committed.

rogue49 · 11-06-2003, 02:28 PM

hmm...I wonder if there is a way to make a clear point
and sound intelligent with facts backing you up?

nah.

eple · 11-06-2003, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rogue49
hmm...I wonder if there is a way to make a clear point
and sound intelligent with facts backing you up?

nah.

Hay, I'm not saying it's impossible, but noen of us are saints in here, and most of us will get emotional and angry and careless and unconstructive. My weak point, for example, is Israel. I am unable to discuss Israel/palestina without at some point reaching a fit and ranting away. This probably means I should stay away from these threads, but my point is that we all have weak points, and many of us will start getting pissed. It's human and shit.

2wolves · 11-06-2003, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by eple
Hay, I'm not saying it's impossible, but noen of us are saints in here,

Bah! Puny human.

St. 2Wolves

John Henry · 12-06-2003, 12:32 PM

Hey, that's a neat little lesson in political rhetoric.
Oh hang on... am I missing the point.
If only people would bear these in mind when listening to politicians.

Did I just write a haiku?... Perhaps not

Astrocloud · 12-08-2003, 05:31 AM

Another website:
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

Ad Hominem
Ad Hominem Tu Quoque
Appeal to Authority
Appeal to Belief
Appeal to Common Practice
Appeal to Consequences of a Belief
Appeal to Emotion
Appeal to Fear
Appeal to Flattery
Appeal to Novelty
Appeal to Pity
Appeal to Popularity
Appeal to Ridicule
Appeal to Spite
Appeal to Tradition
Bandwagon
Begging the Question
Biased Sample
Burden of Proof
Circumstantial Ad Hominem
Composition
Confusing Cause and Effect
Division
False Dilemma
Gambler's Fallacy
Genetic Fallacy
Guilt By Association
Hasty Generalization
Ignoring A Common Cause
Middle Ground
Misleading Vividness
Personal Attack
Poisoning the Well
Post Hoc
Questionable Cause
Red Herring
Relativist Fallacy
Slippery Slope
Special Pleading
Spotlight
Straw Man
Two Wrongs Make A Right

Dwarf020 · 12-08-2003, 07:03 PM

all the professional Logicians are clapping for you, anyway.

ARTelevision · 12-09-2003, 11:05 AM

Thanks for the thread 2wolves.
These were well considered in TFP v3 and it's great to have them appear again!

2wolves · 12-09-2003, 12:55 PM

You're welcome A.T..

Making an effort to actually think about policies, minus the screaming and hand wringing, does much to make the back and forth more civil. There are quite enough screamers already.

Since a great deal of American politics is of the 'gotcha' or horse race meme my title and post is an attempt to subvert that tide.

2Wolves

11-06-2003, 07:29 AM	#1 (permalink)
2wolves Psycho Location: Just outside the D.C. belt	Points for each one you find.... and avoid. http://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.php Full list with more links available at above URL. Fallacies of Distraction False Dilemma: two choices are given when in fact there are three options From Ignorance: because something is not known to be true, it is assumed to be false Slippery Slope: a series of increasingly unacceptable consequences is drawn Complex Question: two unrelated points are conjoined as a single proposition Appeals to Motives in Place of Support Appeal to Force: the reader is persuaded to agree by force Appeal to Pity: the reader is persuaded to agree by sympathy Consequences: the reader is warned of unacceptable consequences Prejudicial Language: value or moral goodness is attached to believing the author Popularity: a proposition is argued to be true because it is widely held to be true Changing the Subject Attacking the Person: the person's character is attacked the person's circumstances are noted the person does not practise what is preached

11-06-2003, 08:44 AM	#3 (permalink)
Conclamo Ludus Modern Man Location: West Michigan	I think you'd be hardpressed to find any post on this board that doesn't fall into one of these. Interesting stuff though. Is there a fallacy that dismisses an argument because it is a fallacy? __________________ Lord, have mercy on my wicked soul I wouldn't mistreat you baby, for my weight in gold. -Son House, Death Letter Blues

12-06-2003, 12:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
John Henry Addict Location: Grey Britain	Hey, that's a neat little lesson in political rhetoric. Oh hang on... am I missing the point. If only people would bear these in mind when listening to politicians. Did I just write a haiku?... Perhaps not __________________ "No one was behaving from very Buddhist motives. Then, thought Pigsy, he was hardly a Buddha, nor was he a monkey. Presently, he was a pig spirit changed into a little girl pretending to be a little boy to be offered to a water monster. It was all very simple to a pig spirit."

12-09-2003, 11:05 AM	#12 (permalink)
ARTelevision I change Location: USA	Thanks for the thread 2wolves. These were well considered in TFP v3 and it's great to have them appear again! __________________ create evolution

12-09-2003, 12:55 PM	#13 (permalink)
2wolves Psycho Location: Just outside the D.C. belt	You're welcome A.T.. Making an effort to actually think about policies, minus the screaming and hand wringing, does much to make the back and forth more civil. There are quite enough screamers already. Since a great deal of American politics is of the 'gotcha' or horse race meme my title and post is an attempt to subvert that tide. 2Wolves __________________ Nation of the Cat. Forgive maybe, forget .... not quite yet.

11-06-2003, 07:45 AM	#2 (permalink)
filtherton Junkie Location: In the land of ice and snow.	Maybe we could come up with icons, similar to the smileys to put after a quote to point out one of these fallacies. We could have a key, with a specific icon for a specific fallacy.

11-06-2003, 11:32 AM	#4 (permalink)
eple Banned Location: norway	Heh, I really wonder if it is possible to discuss at all without breaking a few of these rules. The icon thingie was a good idea filtherton, but they might get a disturbance too, as people would start debating the use of the icons, instead of focussing on the real issue...

11-06-2003, 02:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
rogue49 Loser	hmm...I wonder if there is a way to make a clear point and sound intelligent with facts backing you up? nah.

12-08-2003, 05:31 AM	#10 (permalink)
Astrocloud Apocalypse Nerd	Another website: http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ Ad Hominem Ad Hominem Tu Quoque Appeal to Authority Appeal to Belief Appeal to Common Practice Appeal to Consequences of a Belief Appeal to Emotion Appeal to Fear Appeal to Flattery Appeal to Novelty Appeal to Pity Appeal to Popularity Appeal to Ridicule Appeal to Spite Appeal to Tradition Bandwagon Begging the Question Biased Sample Burden of Proof Circumstantial Ad Hominem Composition Confusing Cause and Effect Division False Dilemma Gambler's Fallacy Genetic Fallacy Guilt By Association Hasty Generalization Ignoring A Common Cause Middle Ground Misleading Vividness Personal Attack Poisoning the Well Post Hoc Questionable Cause Red Herring Relativist Fallacy Slippery Slope Special Pleading Spotlight Straw Man Two Wrongs Make A Right

12-08-2003, 07:03 PM	#11 (permalink)
Dwarf020 Tilted	all the professional Logicians are clapping for you, anyway.