Double Standard against Gays? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Rekna · 01-30-2004, 02:50 PM

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,109938,00.html

Quote:

TOPEKA, Kan. — Kansas can punish someone more harshly for having sex with a minor if the minor is of the same sex, the state Court of Appeals ruled Friday.

A three-judge panel, splitting 2-1, rejected the appeal of Matthew R. Limon, sentenced to more than 17 years in prison for having sex with an underage boy in 2000.

Had Limon engaged in sex with an underage girl, he could have been sentenced to one year and three months in prison.

The American Civil Liberties Union (search), which represented Limon, and other gay rights activists had hoped the court would declare that the difference in sentencing represented unconstitutional discrimination against gays and lesbians.

Limon's conviction stems from acts with a 14-year-old boy. Both were residents of a Paola group home for the developmentally disabled. Limon was 18 at the time.

The Court of Appeals also rejected Limon's challenge in February 2002, but last June the U.S. Supreme Court struck down a Texas law criminalizing gay sex and returned Limon's case to Kansas, resulting in the December rehearing before the appeals court.

Kansas law makes any sexual activity involving a person under 16 illegal, regardless of the context. The attorney general's office made much of Limon having two previous, similar offenses on his record, suggesting they helped justify his lengthy sentence.

Limon could have received a much lighter sentence had he or the 14-year-old boy, identified only as M.A.R, been female because a 1999 statute, known as the "Romeo and Juliet" law (search), provides lesser penalties for consensual sex when one partner is 19 or under and the other partner's age is within four years.

Disclamer* I am not endorsing the actions of this young man. He had sex with a child under the age of 16 which is wrong. I am mearly asking if the double standard against gays is fair.

Personally I think that this is an unfair double standard. I think the fact that a 18 year old boy having sex with a 14 year old is wrong and I'd rather not hear the details of gay sex but to have seperate punishments because this was a gay act seems horribly wrong.

Strange Famous · 01-30-2004, 02:57 PM

I agree completely. This act of discrimination is illegal and should be overuled by the federal court. It is incredible and offensive that homosexual male children should enjoy so much greater protection under the law then heterosexual female children.

Mojo_PeiPei · 01-30-2004, 04:15 PM

Note how they said it was his third offense with similar charges. Not mention that Kansas may have sodomy laws on the book. Outside of that, then yes it is backwards. But whatever oneless Pederass (shut the fuck up Donnie) to harm minors.

KellyC · 01-30-2004, 10:13 PM

well..at least in jail..hes gonna get all the gay sex he wants...LOL

-apologies in advance if its inapropriate.

wario · 01-30-2004, 10:29 PM

Think of it this way.
As a straight little boy, would you be more pissed about being molested by a woman or a man?
But then again, if we're going by that, ugly women would also be given harsher penalties...

Moskie · 01-30-2004, 11:32 PM

Well, this may or may not be a threadjack, but the problems we see this case parallel the problems I have with Hate Crime Legislation.

In a sense, the guy in this case is getting overly punished because he's homosexual (or, at least, because he committed a homosexual act). Much in the same way hate crime legislation would overly punish a criminal for being a racist (or a homophobe, etc.). And it should not be a crime to be either a homosexual or a racist.

Some might say that there's a clear difference between these two scenarios, in that there's nothing wrong with homosexuality, while there's something clearly wrong with racism. I'd wholeheartedly agree with that, but I also realize those are completely subjective opinions. And in any case, determining the right/wrongness of either homosexuality or racism is not something for the courts, or even the government, to decide.

Just my two cents. Ironic that I turned this case into something that shows my dislike for hate crime legislation, when it itself is a hate crime.

seretogis · 01-30-2004, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
Note how they said it was his third offense with similar charges.

Thank you Mojo.

I feel that all sex offenders need to be punished much more harshly than they currently are. On a side note, the MN Governor is trying to get a referendum going to reinstate the death penalty, hopefully to be used on repeat sex offenders. :P

wilbjammin · 01-31-2004, 12:10 AM

Man, the guy is 18 and the next 17 years of his life he's in prison. That seems excessive to me for someone so young... I think he could use some help from the sound of the article, if this a sort of pattern he had been in. I think that sexual crimes are among the worst of all, but to me this seems a bit much. I would like to see parity between punishments for male-female situations that are similar. A year and 3 months seems too short to me, if you want someone to get help and to prevent that kind of thing happening again they are going to need mental help... and it will take considerable time to establish a pattern in meetings with a licensed professional to know if it really is likely that a repeat offense could happen.

Mojo_PeiPei · 01-31-2004, 12:25 AM

He had THREE prior offences(sp)... wouldn't that warrant a life sentence is places such as California? I don't give a fuck if this ass fuck is 18 or not. Learn to control yourself, God knows 99.9999995467% of the rest of the population does.

bigbad · 01-31-2004, 01:57 AM

As the age of consent in BC is 14, I think this is WAAAAAAAAAAY too strict of a punishment regardless of the gender of the "victim". This guy would not be considered a "pederass" up here. Also, "Both were residents of a Paola group home for the developmentally disabled." That means he might not be responsible for his actions. This is so messed up, Kansas is still living in the middle ages with laws like these :\

Rekna · 01-31-2004, 08:21 AM

For those of you that think his punishment is fair, if he would have had sex with a girl do you think the punishment should be the same?

The topic here is not whether the punishment was to much or to little. It is whether there should be a double standard if it was a homosexual act or heterosexual act.

Mojo_PeiPei · 01-31-2004, 08:57 AM

Why do people always try and displace blame. It wasn't his fault he did something wrong... for the third time.... it was big government for having the age of consent at 16. Thats victimize the perpetrator. Also it doesn't surprise me that the ACLU is getting involved in this case. I mean here they are defending NAMBLA in Boston, and trying to get the age of consent lowered to 12 in Missouri.

filtherton · 01-31-2004, 04:38 PM

It is unfair simply for the fact that there is no "romeo and mercutio" to go along with the "romeo and juliet" law.

01-30-2004, 02:57 PM	#2 (permalink)
Strange Famous follower of the child's crusade?	I agree completely. This act of discrimination is illegal and should be overuled by the federal court. It is incredible and offensive that homosexual male children should enjoy so much greater protection under the law then heterosexual female children. __________________ "Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas

01-30-2004, 04:15 PM	#3 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Note how they said it was his third offense with similar charges. Not mention that Kansas may have sodomy laws on the book. Outside of that, then yes it is backwards. But whatever oneless Pederass (shut the fuck up Donnie) to harm minors. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

01-30-2004, 11:32 PM	#6 (permalink)
Moskie Pure Chewing Satisfaction Location: can i use bbcode [i]here[/i]?	Well, this may or may not be a threadjack, but the problems we see this case parallel the problems I have with Hate Crime Legislation. In a sense, the guy in this case is getting overly punished because he's homosexual (or, at least, because he committed a homosexual act). Much in the same way hate crime legislation would overly punish a criminal for being a racist (or a homophobe, etc.). And it should not be a crime to be either a homosexual or a racist. Some might say that there's a clear difference between these two scenarios, in that there's nothing wrong with homosexuality, while there's something clearly wrong with racism. I'd wholeheartedly agree with that, but I also realize those are completely subjective opinions. And in any case, determining the right/wrongness of either homosexuality or racism is not something for the courts, or even the government, to decide. Just my two cents. Ironic that I turned this case into something that shows my dislike for hate crime legislation, when it itself is a hate crime. __________________ Greetings and salutations.

01-31-2004, 12:10 AM	#8 (permalink)
wilbjammin * * *	Man, the guy is 18 and the next 17 years of his life he's in prison. That seems excessive to me for someone so young... I think he could use some help from the sound of the article, if this a sort of pattern he had been in. I think that sexual crimes are among the worst of all, but to me this seems a bit much. I would like to see parity between punishments for male-female situations that are similar. A year and 3 months seems too short to me, if you want someone to get help and to prevent that kind of thing happening again they are going to need mental help... and it will take considerable time to establish a pattern in meetings with a licensed professional to know if it really is likely that a repeat offense could happen. __________________ Innominate.

01-31-2004, 12:25 AM	#9 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	He had THREE prior offences(sp)... wouldn't that warrant a life sentence is places such as California? I don't give a fuck if this ass fuck is 18 or not. Learn to control yourself, God knows 99.9999995467% of the rest of the population does. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

01-30-2004, 10:13 PM	#4 (permalink)
KellyC Comment or else!! Location: Home sweet home	well..at least in jail..hes gonna get all the gay sex he wants...LOL -apologies in advance if its inapropriate.

01-30-2004, 10:29 PM	#5 (permalink)
wario Insane	Think of it this way. As a straight little boy, would you be more pissed about being molested by a woman or a man? But then again, if we're going by that, ugly women would also be given harsher penalties...

01-31-2004, 01:57 AM	#10 (permalink)
bigbad Insane	As the age of consent in BC is 14, I think this is WAAAAAAAAAAY too strict of a punishment regardless of the gender of the "victim". This guy would not be considered a "pederass" up here. Also, "Both were residents of a Paola group home for the developmentally disabled." That means he might not be responsible for his actions. This is so messed up, Kansas is still living in the middle ages with laws like these :\

01-31-2004, 08:21 AM	#11 (permalink)
Rekna Junkie	For those of you that think his punishment is fair, if he would have had sex with a girl do you think the punishment should be the same? The topic here is not whether the punishment was to much or to little. It is whether there should be a double standard if it was a homosexual act or heterosexual act.

01-31-2004, 08:57 AM	#12 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Why do people always try and displace blame. It wasn't his fault he did something wrong... for the third time.... it was big government for having the age of consent at 16. Thats victimize the perpetrator. Also it doesn't surprise me that the ACLU is getting involved in this case. I mean here they are defending NAMBLA in Boston, and trying to get the age of consent lowered to 12 in Missouri. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

01-31-2004, 04:38 PM	#13 (permalink)
filtherton Junkie Location: In the land of ice and snow.	It is unfair simply for the fact that there is no "romeo and mercutio" to go along with the "romeo and juliet" law.