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Old 12-12-2003, 03:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Location: California
Red Hat CEO - Use Windows,It's Better


Matthew Szulik, chief executive of Linux vendor Red Hat, said on Monday that although Linux is capable of exceeding expectations for corporate users, home users should stick with Windows: "I would say that for the consumer market place, Windows probably continues to be the right product line," he said. "I would argue that from the device-driver standpoint and perhaps some of the other traditional functionality, for that classic consumer purchaser, it is my view that (Linux) technology needs to mature a little bit more."



Albert Einstein once said insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Desktop Linux is insane. It's not working, nor will it ever work if the Linux community stays insane. Stop being so elitist, stop telling people to RTFM when they don't know how to do this or that. But most of all, stop thinking your way is better than that guy's way, and instead collaborate and create ONE product to fight the Microsoft behemoth. You've already shown that on the server side Linux is clearly superior than Windows, but damn, how many window managers does the world need? Until then, you're a bunch of chickens running around with your heads cut off, talented and gifted yes, but with no single driving force.
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Old 12-12-2003, 04:20 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Location: City of Lights
Personally I use Linux for my desktop because I enjoy the challenge it gives me and the things I learn. I recently interviewed for a job that was 50% questions about *nix and how it works. Without having Linux as my desktop system, I would have been screwed. Luckily I've learned enough of Linux that I got most of the answers correct.. and got the job. Without Desktop Linux.. then I'd still be an unemployed Windows geek.
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Old 12-12-2003, 04:30 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Location: Yonder
I use Linux on my desktop(s) because it's 100% flexible to the way I want to work. Windows makes me work Bill's way.

That said, I COMPLETELY agree with the sentiment that command-line snobbery and RTFM rudeness isn't going to win the desktop war any time in our lifetime. Though I don't quite agree with Szulik that the war is already lost.
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Old 12-12-2003, 04:40 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Location: I dunno, there's white people around me saying "eh" all the time
At least the Red Hat CEO is honest. I mean, seriously how many average people do you really know would know how to work Linux? Compared to Windows, linux is kinda like an "industrial" kind of operating systems and by that I meant you don't see average people running around and trying to work things in manufacturing eh? I have linux and windows xp but I prefer to use XP for surfing the net and use linux for programming.
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Old 12-12-2003, 05:38 PM   #5 (permalink)
Location: North Hollywood
I think netbsd is better for server stuff, and windows xp is better for most desktop users.

I can use xwindows or telnet to connect to a *nix box if i need to use *nix, though so far i haven't had too, theres nothing i need that i can't get on XP, and i'd consider myself an industrial power user.

I'm glad to see him say that, its what people have been saying for ages, and it'll keep linux firmly implanted in the small minority of like minded individuals for the most part. He of course realises that in order to stay in business its going to have to happen, it'll become more and more like windows, i often see peoples linux desktops that are a clone of windows. OSX is doing what linux didn't imho.

Its horses for courses, you choose whats best for the situation, but i can't see a reason why i would choose linux over netbsd if i needed it, (and i'd probably end up using windows server which i do), but for a network computer or internet server, i'd use netbsd.
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Old 12-12-2003, 08:45 PM   #6 (permalink)
As much as I like linux, I tend to agree that it's not ready for most consumers. I only know one person that would be able to figure out how to deal with anything that inevitably arises in Linux. I know a lot of people that have difficulty saving a file to a floppy disk, I can't imagine the havoc that would result if they tried Linux.
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Old 12-12-2003, 08:48 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Location: Chapel Hill, NC
For most users, it is. Most users want to plug their stuff in and have it work. They dont want to have to download drivers, compile them, and possibly do a kernel rebuild... Hell, most people dont know what any of those are. For them, Windows works fine. XPs autodetect, while a pain in the ass for many powerusers, is incredible for the average user--plug something in, and it just *works*.

Personally, I use Windows less and less everyday, but Im not your average computer user, neither are most of the people on this board.
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Old 12-13-2003, 12:52 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Location: Chicago
The statement is both right and wrong.

Right in the sense that many users today can't handle Linux yet, but wrong in the sense that Linux itself is not the fault for that.

First of all, most problems with driver availablity, etc, stems from the fact that there is a small minority of people using Linux. Linux needs people such as myself (I'm not trying to be pompous or anything, I just mean people who are not programmers but use Linux because of the ideologies behind it and freeedom it provides) to be using it and put their money behind it so that companies for webcams, digital cameras, printers, etc put THEIR money into the fairly simple task of developing drivers for it as well as Windows. As far as things like it being hard to save to a floppy, that's a simple matter of there being a distro that makes it easy. Some distros do not make it easy and are obviously not meant for your average desktop user - such as Gentoo - but other distros are easily ready. Mandrake automatically mounts the floppy when it is inserted, so saving to it is just as easy as saving to a floppy in Windows.

When a user is required to install and set up Linux themself, it is most certainly not ready. But I am more than confident that if Mandrake or a similar distro were pre-installed on a system and set up in a way designed for home use - and if the drivers would be provided by more manufacturers - that my mom could easily use Linux for what she needs a computer for. Sure, tech support will be necessary from time to time - but it is with Windows as well. IT is with anything new. When my parents first got a computer, and again when they first got a computer with a post Windows 3.1 OS, they made many calls to tech support. Those calls always lessened as time went on. That's what happens when you try something new.

The Red Hat CEO is correct in saying that Linux overall is not ready for the average consumer desktop use. If you look at all distros as a possibility that's an easy conclusion. But there are a few distros that are capable of being ready. He was not wrong in saying, however, that users should stick with Windows. A MUCH better way to put it is that the average user should approach Linux with caution and realize that it works very differently from Windows and that tech support will likely be needed from time to time.
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Old 12-13-2003, 11:07 AM   #9 (permalink)
Location: Toronto
I've come to such a point after having used linux as a desktop, and using it at work, that now windows seriously annoys me. Luckilly, I only really use it now for games that don't run under Lin for me. That windows cut and paste is poison!

I don't really care who uses windows for a desktop. If they are, I'd probably agree that it's a better solution for them. As long as I'm able to have the choice, I'm pretty content.
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Old 12-13-2003, 01:02 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Location: Manhattan, NY
Originally posted by sailor420
For most users, it is. Most users want to plug their stuff in and have it work. They dont want to have to download drivers, compile them, and possibly do a kernel rebuild... Hell, most people dont know what any of those are. For them, Windows works fine. XPs autodetect, while a pain in the ass for many powerusers, is incredible for the average user--plug something in, and it just *works*.

Personally, I use Windows less and less everyday, but Im not your average computer user, neither are most of the people on this board.
I am not your average user. I build networks and work on plenty of large systems, but I'm not interested in tweaking when I get home. I want it to just work, work easily, I don't want to have to dig into too many FAQs or Forums to find answers if I do have a problem.

From a corporate standpoint, the total cost of ownership for a linux box isn't really good data yet. There's not enough trend. Then there's expertise, yes, you'll find a good person, but when that person hits the wall? finding an answer will take some time possibly more time than MS.

When I ran the support systems I was on the phone with MS on a regular basis, and they were VERY responsive to our needs and addressed them very timely.
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