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E-Reader advice

Discussion in 'Tilted Gear' started by CoffeeBee, Aug 15, 2011.

  1. martian

    martian Server Monkey Staff Member

    Location:
    Mars
    You're making the assumption that "they" have any sort of choice in the matter. The music industry didn't want to embrace digital distribution. Why would they? There's no scenario where they get as much money out of a digital product as they do out of a physical one. In the end, though, they didn't have much of a choice; it became apparent that there was a strong demand for music in a digital format available online, and the only options were to provide it or let the listeners provide it for themselves. Book publishers are now going to find themselves facing a similar choice.

    In light of that I don't see how you can make a statement like yours. As Cynthetiq pointed out college students are generally rich in time and poor in money, and while digitizing a book can be time consuming if it means that you can get all your other books free it's a worthwhile trade. You're going to what, rely on the strong history of college students opposing online copyright infringement?
     
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  2. EventHorizon

    EventHorizon assuredly the cause of the angry Economy..

    Location:
    FREEDOM!
    what about the fact that you don't need to spend money on a physical product? what about the fact that the Internet Music Store isn't closed on Sundays or holidays or at strange hours of the day? what about not having the expenses that a music store has in terms or shipping a physical product to a bunch of different stores who will only buy your product if they can turn around and sell it with enough money left over to pay their own dudes? i can't imagine the staff running the iTunes store numbering more than 1000 people which is far less than the number of music stores, much less the employees working there, thus saving The Man some all those extra benjies.

     
  3. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    What do you mean "going to"? ;)

    I think they should just come up with agreements to have the schools pay for the textbook licenses and then pass some or all of the cost on to the students if need be. Harsh? Well, so's being a publisher in the digital age. People who make textbooks aren't doing it out of charity.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Leto

    Leto Slightly Tilted

    Location:
    Toronto
    I have the identical e-reader - as well as two different generations of Kobo and a Kindle. My fav right now is the relatively compact Kobo touch - about the same size as the Aluratek. But I still like my Aluratek. It's sturdy, kinda street looking and I'm not afraid of damaging in. It's been about a year and a half now with it and it is still the best bang for the buck these days (about $60 eh?) The Kobo Touch is the next best.
     
  5. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    The physical product and its distribution are only a small fraction of the expense involved in producing textbooks. The overhead for running digital distribution, stores, databasing, etc., though likely much less expensive than traditional overhead, is not something to be overlooked as an expense.
     
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  6. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Here's a quick list of one file

    Here's what is happening in that arena and why it's so easy, it's $300 and time. I'm sure that if I was a college student today, I'd gather me up $300 and put one of these things together. I'd charge you $20 a book to digitize. Once I've got it, I'll sell that book over and over again to your fellow classmates, recovering my $300 in just 15 people, probably not even 1/2 of the classroom. Heck if I did it with 2 books, it's even easier to sell and my library gets bigger and bigger. I get more potential customers each book I digitize.

     
  7. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    In a few short years, eBooks are projected to be a $5 billion industry in the U.S. in a book industry currently sized at $15.5 billion. Despite how many pirates there are out there rigging a side business, there will likely still be a market for digital textbooks, especially when you have Apple selling 350,000 digital textbooks in three days.
     
  8. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Of course, I don't doubt that. Our own projections are trying to move our business in that direction of electronic delivery.
    There really isn't all that much savings in the publishing sector. Really publishing doesn't make the same profit margin that music did. Most books never earn out their advances and many authors never get more royalties than the advance they were given.

    Right, not only do you not factor in the marketing department, accounting, you still have to pay for infrastructure costs to warehouse the digital assets. MTV spent $14M for their digital library warehouse and that only got them 7Pb, if I recall correctly. IT people aren't cheap and neither are datacenters.
     
  9. Zweiblumen

    Zweiblumen Slightly Tilted

    Location:
    Iceland
    I read somewhere that books where among the first victims of digital piracy, as text requires much less storeage and bandwidth than audio and video. And it dates back to BBS and dial-up modems.
     
  10. Pixel

    Pixel Getting Tilted

    Location:
    Missoura
    Publishers don't actually make that much on textbooks. They cost so much because of their limited runs in publishing. A mass produced book costs so little in comparison because of the huge printings they get. Publishers will probably actually more money in digital publishing because of no press costs.
     
  11. EventHorizon

    EventHorizon assuredly the cause of the angry Economy..

    Location:
    FREEDOM!
    unless textbook pirating gets to be as popular as movie/music pirating in which case they'll almost have to give away the textbooks instead of charging $150+.
     
  12. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    Textbooks differ from trade books in that they require much more work and expertise on the author (often multiple) and production (editorial, design, layout) end. I've worked on many nonfiction trade books, and they're difficult enough. Compare a typical personal finance book to some of the specialized business texts out there and you'll see what I mean. It's two very different kinds of publishing.

    The overall risk here is the money being siphoned out of the textbook industry, making it not worthwhile to have top-notch and relevant materials put together by leading industry professionals. The overall risk here is a degradation of valuable information meant for a quality learning environment. The overall risk here is a degradation of education itself.

    I don't think it will happen. I think the money will come from somewhere. However, the real challenge is in the business models. The publishing industry is lurching and writhing on all levels right now.
     
  13. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Yes, that's very true. Many sci-fi ebooks today are remnants of the first .txt uploads onto BBS.

    Press costs are the smallest portion of the costs. Really, printing in China and India is very cheap, shipping very cheap because it's by boat.

    When it comes to grade schools there is something called State Adoption which means that 22 different states agree and pool their interests for publishing textbooks. Prices are guaranteed through the life of the adoption period. It is quite profitable for both sides because it reduces costs and it also guarantees sales.

    Yes. I cannot begin to explain how convoluted and complexity of dealing with the education group requirements. It is very challenging because of all the contributors from authors to photographers to illustrators and contributors. Paying out royalties is a major pain in the ass.
     
  14. Baraka_Guru

    Baraka_Guru Möderätor Staff Member

    Location:
    Toronto
    I don't envy you. However, working in small press publishing has its own challenges. One being not really "paying out royalties" so much as "telling nearly your entire roster of authors that they still haven't earned out their advances." :(
     
  15. EventHorizon

    EventHorizon assuredly the cause of the angry Economy..

    Location:
    FREEDOM!
    ok, but what about the colleges where every student is buying their own texts with a higher chance for buying a shiny new one than getting a ratty 5 year old hand-me-down?
     
  16. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    Depending on the author of the text, many professors teach from texts they have contributed to or wrote entirely.

    I can't verify this exact quote, but it isn't much different than doctors pushing certain drug therapies over another. I do read that this is a common practice with regards to collegiate textbooks. Also, each edition is another opportunity for the author/contributor to get another advance, so reprinting another edition with the smallest of changes guarantees a certain amount of sales each and every year and it all looks on the up and up.
     
  17. EventHorizon

    EventHorizon assuredly the cause of the angry Economy..

    Location:
    FREEDOM!
    i agree, but isn't that just more cause for them to stick with paper copies so they can sell more and more and more and more and more?
     
  18. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    No, because etexts are going to be the future. No doubt about it. They can do the same with little to no costs for the paper elements. They just update the etextbook version.
     
  19. martian

    martian Server Monkey Staff Member

    Location:
    Mars
    I'm not certain you're fully understanding the issue. The simple fact is that there's a demand for digital textbooks, and if the publishers don't fulfill that demand somebody else will. It's not particularly difficult to digitize a textbook -- time consuming, sure, but the necessary tools and information are readily available for anyone who wants them. This is again similar to the situation the music industry faced a decade ago. People wanted digital music, the music industry chose not to fulfill that demand. Users decided to fulfill it themselves, and a decade of losing legal battles followed. Publishers are on the cusp of facing the same dilemma; ebook readers are becoming mainstream consumer appliances now, which is creating a widespread demand for ebooks. One way or another, this demand will be filled. The publishing industry has little choice but to enter the market at the bottom level and attempt to assume a controlling position. Doing anything else is suicide.

    I'm not arguing in favour of copyright infringement, but rather simple pragmatism. You can't legislate away technical issues, and every time they successfully shut down one system of sharing a new, more sophisticated version will take it's place. The appropriate response is to compete, rather than litigate.
     
  20. cynthetiq

    cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    New York City
    The problem for everyone is not different for the music business. The format is good going forward, but what about the back catalog? Try finding some of those rare vinyl and you're not going to find an equivalent mp3 of it unless some collector ripped his collection and shared it.

    The same thing goes for books. You just don't scan a book and turn it into an ebook. You also don't just take the digital PDF files and turn it into an ebook. No different than you not retypesetting Harry Potter hardcover for the trade paperback and the pocketbook version if that ever comes out. There will be people who want to read it, and will be satisfied with the photo pdf scans just like Google Books, but normal mainstream? Not interested in wonky page formatting.

    There's no profit to that for most publishers because the total sales. I just saw royalties for Hunger Games, holy shit it was a lot of money. But that's VERY VERY rare. Most make money off subsidiary rights, like movies and merchandising. Look carefully at the HP movies and see that the US publisher did not get the option. What a fucked up thing that was because they missed a very important revenue stream.