Politics Gun violence in CT

I hope there is a special place in hell for him.
Kids, i mean fuck 5 year old kids.

 

Sadly, I dont think we'll ever have a serious comprehensive high level policy discussion on gun violence in the US. The right and the NRA will demagogue it as infringing on their Second Amendments rights before such a discussion can even begin and the left doesnt have the stomach for it.

 

Interesting reading (as was the Guardian piece). The comments were also fascinating and quite revealing about attitudes concerning ethnicity, I thought.

 

The Second Amendment has outlived it's usefulness. It needs to be amended to reflect the 21st Century

 

Federal laws have come a long way in providing mental health parity and will go even further with Affordable Care Act.

Yet, at the same time, federal gun laws have loopholes that enable persons with mental illness to walk into any gun show (or go to gun sale websites) and purchase w/o a background check.
--- merged: Dec 14, 2012 at 6:20 PM ---
God allowed the shooting to happen because prayer, the Bible, and the Ten Commandments are not taught in public schools and "God is a gentleman" who does not go where he is not wanted.

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View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=is2x7QTZ8AI​

 

It would be easy to find these positions contradictory to their claim that mental illness is the problem rather than guns - if gun control and better availability to mental health care was necessary to remedy the problem. It's not, of course. The answer is to arm all the sane and law abiding people.

First time I heard this, I thought it was a joke.

 

The paranoid Right need to calm down. On another forum, they think these shootings are conspiracy by the Left to enact gun control...

And the 20s are a transitioning phase, yet it isn't handled very good by society at all. It's not the 20 year old's fault. They are expected to have a car, live on their own (or with roommates in expensive cities), live on the good part of town, have a relationship...and if you don't you are a failure. If you go to school, yet can't get a job you are a failure, even if it is because people are working in their 70s and getting SS and not retiring. (our company finally hired two 20-somethings this year because a guy retired on his 71st birthday, and we still have 4 more 65+ people who have plenty of money that could retire...)

As for guns, there needs to be a real discussion and the well regulated militia can't be a bunch of paranoid anti-government fanatics. Quite frankly, there should be a one weekend a year gun school and safety class that people have to pass to own guns. And make sure they are safe and qualified to own them. And if I wouldn't have been banned from owning guns in my mid-20s, then the system is broken.

And yes, mental health should be free for anyone, at least for the first few sessions. It shouldn't be used against them in future employment possibilities. But, anyone getting help should be barred from purchasing guns or being around them.

That is the problem with the gun culture in the US. That it is more acceptable to buy a gun than to go to a therapist.

 

You know it's just sad that this even happens in the USA. I rack my brain and try to understand why or how a person even gets in this mind set of killing. Do they not see the children in front of them as they kill them.
What is going through there thoughts?
Are they delusional, are they disassociated from reality. Does anyone really know the answer to stop something like this. Where is a person's intuition on a situation like this? WHO BUZED HIM IN THAT DOOR??????

That was the protection for those kids, who buzzed him in?

 

Note the number of fatalities caused by the knife wielder: 0. If anything, this implications of this undermine your point. It is a lot harder to kill 26 people with a knife than it is with a set of guns.

 

Summoning Plan 9. This thread needs him because it just doesn't feel right without him here.

 

It is extreme depression. But instead of just committing suicide, you want to take out other people too. Most of the time it can be targeted, but a lot of it is random people who just happen to be in the wrong place.

Not really.

There is nothing to live for. I'm not sure about the small kids, but shooting other people who are leading 'normal' lives when you aren't can be justified in the shooters mind.

A lot of times it is planned in advance, it might not be much of a plan, but it's not like they were normal one day and then grab as many guns as they can get the next.

It was an elementary school where his Mom worked. I would say that it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibilities that he said he was there to give something to her. They weren't expecting this, nor should they be that paranoid to have to. Yet, with the massive numbers of these happening since the 90's, something's not quite right.

 

It's sad where ever it happens and what is sad as well,is the fact that the entire world is no longer surprised when it happens in the US because it happens so frequently these days. We've become a very violent country over the years and our denial over that fact has prevented us from looking at ways to correct it.

I suspect that RAGE, bottled up for years and exacerbated by depression, is the culprit. It prevents those afflicted with it from considering anyone but themselves and allows them to justify their actions. But that's an observation which does little to promote understanding by those of us who have never experienced it.

He was fully armed. He didn't need anyone to buzz him in, providing the school even had that security measure in place.(not all schools do) In fact, according to the accounts, he went into the front office first and started shooting.

This young man was not thinking as you and I would. Why he wasn't is a question that cannot be answered because we were not privy to his life, his emotions, his relationships or his thought processes. Even if we knew all that, we still don't have enough insight in the human psyche to effectively "cure" those who go off the mental rails. Mores the pity.

 

This us why policies and rules are in place. I know how people don't follow the rules because it might upset someone, you know push them through.

They have the same system at my school district. Even at my work place. You don't get BUZED in until the person you ask for comes down and signs you in.
Simple and keeps the employees safe.

The massive numbers I just don't understand.

 

Security measures only go so far.

BBC News - China school knife attack in Henan injures 22 children

This guy stabbed a bunch of kids outside the gate.

I mean, if we were fighting 'real' terrorists after 9/11, the security lines would be the ideal place for a mass shooting or suicide bomber to go to. There were a lot more people there than on any one airplane.

Also, you can use mental health professionals to reach the people who reach that point, but we need to figure out how to prevent people from getting to that point in the first place.

 

While I'm certainly not pro-knife violence, notice that the knife guy wasn't able to kill anyone. How many would we expect him to have killed of he had two handguns?

 

Why not ask the question, what could have been done to improve these guys lives and not have them even think about doing something like this?

 

When you have beaucoup ammo loaded in multiple weapons which are all able to deliver about 6 rounds every second, the numbers have a habit of climbing.

No disrespect intended but your comment points out perfectly the point many of us have been attempting to make.

Imagine you're a parent of one of these children (personally, I can't go there) and you live with the realization that if Adam Lanza didn't have these high powered, combat ready weapons, with plenty of ammo to go with them, but had instead a basic, single loaded handgun able to deliver death rounds more slowly which required a tedious amount of time for reloading, your son or daughter might still be alive. Would that piss you the fuck off? It would sure piss me off.

There's not one culprit here, there's two. One is dead but the other one is still alive and kicking, ready for the next round of mayhem.

 

That's a worthwhile question too.