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Politics The 4th Estate - Media....is it truth or fiction? TFP pundits will examine.

Discussion in 'Tilted Philosophy, Politics, and Economics' started by rogue49, Nov 5, 2012.

  1. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Barack Obama is in your face!
    Simon says a better politics needs a better media.

    I like the last lines...
    :rolleyes:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    He looked like he was giving a campaign speech for 2016.

    Some candidates will need to use that line on both sides of the aisle.
     
  3. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Bad news for the Big News ;)

    Cable News Nightmare: Turn Off, Tune Out

    I know I get my news from the web, news aggregate sites...or at least certain ones that are not too biased one side or the other.
    TV is only for video that isn't good enough through streaming. (but even then I can DVR it and skip though the commercials and other items I'm not interested in)

    Times change
    And so does the New York Times
    And Time
    And Prime Time
    And...
     
  4. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    THIS
    How Obama wooed back Merkel

    This is the kind of news article I like
    A perspective you don't don't normally get, an inside track, insightful, not lop-sided, real, gives some current play, true past and looks to the future (and not too long or wonky)

    Not SSDD
    If only they could all be like this...friggin mass media.
     
  5. loquitur

    loquitur Getting Tilted

    Whenever people discuss whether the media are reliable, I mention "Murray Gell-Mann Amnesia." Gell-Mann was a Nobel prize winning physicist. He commented that people who have expertise or knowledge in a certain area can read a story in the newspaper about that subject and think to themselves "that reporter has no clue what he's talking about. This article is gibberish." They then turn the page and read the next article, on a different subject, and consider themselves well-informed even though on the subject they know about they consider the same newspapers unreliable.

    Gell-Mann was right.

    In the few instances where a case I was working on got written up in the press, I found that the articles were never more than 2/3 to 3/4 correct. Often less than that. I don't know whether it's because of incompetence, laziness, stupidity, deadlines or something else. It may be because journalists have no expertise about anything and so are trying to come up to speed very quickly in an area they are unfamiliar with. But the bottom line is, beware of what you read in the press.

    And that doesn't even begin to talk about biases.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & don't criticize.

    Location:
    Large City, TX
    One of my journalism professors, a former working journalist, said, "Most journalists know a little about many things, but not a lot about just one thing." It would nearly impossible for general assignment journalists to read everything they need to read in order to be truly thorough. A journalist who specializes in one area, and isn't under deadline, should make every attempt to be as thorough as possible.

    There is always going to be tension between the experts on the subject, and the journalists who attempt to write about the subject. Some experts are pompous asses who offer only partial information, the same as some journalists are lazy and/or incompetent.
     
  7. loquitur

    loquitur Getting Tilted

    That's an excuse, not a refutation. It may even be a good excuse. But what it actually should tell you is to be very wary of what you read in the newspapers.
     
  8. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & don't criticize.

    Location:
    Large City, TX

    Yes, be wary because much of what you read in the newspapers is not written by journalists who specialize in certain fields. And even the ones who do don't always get it right.

    There are some subjects (a complicated scientific breakthrough, for example) that would require lengthy multi-part articles to be properly reported. Many times that information has to condensed into much shorter articles, hence they won't be complete even if written by journalist who specializes in the subject.

    For better or worse, newspapers are for-profit businesses. Fires, murders, sensational trials, and the like sell papers/subscriptions. Long articles on comparatively 'boring' subjects that only appeal to a small number of readers do not.
     
  9. loquitur

    loquitur Getting Tilted

    It's worse than that. Even simple articles about what happened at a location at a specific time are rarely more than half accurate, at least the ones I have read about events I witnessed personally. I believe it's the pressure of deadlines combined with the writer's preconceptions. It's not only about expertise.
     
  10. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & don't criticize.

    Location:
    Large City, TX

    I agree.

    Another factor is newspapers have been closing, and the survivors have been majorly downsizing. Less advertising revenue means smaller papers with fewer articles, esp. fewer detailed articles. Most people over 40 (certainly an arbitrary cutoff age) probably remember large cities having two, perhaps more, competing daily newspapers. Not anymore, with few exceptions.
     
  11. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    It’s time for TV news to stop playing the stooge for Donald Trump

    No shit, Sherlock...but are they going to do anything about it???
    Actually, this goes for ANY topic of choice for them.

    The media now treats news as a reality show.
    So who's going to play them best...a media expert, a reality TV host.

    It's now tabloid journalism...but it extends to most TV news.
    It's about the headline, the spin, the thing that sticks...not the substance.
    What sells. What's not boring. What's easy.

    They play to our basest instincts...for m0ney.
    And sooner or later, TV will become the news scene from Idiocracy.
    [​IMG]
     
  12. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    It's all about ratings, putting out quick news stories on deadline, and going in the direction of the billionaire owner wants it to go. Corporations spend millions to buy advertising and get their message out in the news cycle now, and I doubt that it will change anytime soon.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & don't criticize.

    Location:
    Large City, TX
    And the companies that own the media are even more blatantly using their news media to promote their entertainment media.


    When Goliath Media Monopoly starts ordering their Serious National & World News Division to include an entertainment feature on a new movie made by a company owned by GMM........................
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Looks like the media is starting to have a bit of guilty complex about the whole Trump thing...
    The Media Freak-Out

    My question is this...sure they may do it now.
    But what about next time...or even all points in-between??
    Can we trust them?
     
  15. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    I'm not sure I would put all the blame on the media for Trump and the Tea Party. Sure the media didn't do a very good job, but there are plenty of politicians and think tanks who helped to create the Tea Party. And even though they were thinking the same things Trump is saying, only The Daily Show really would do the digging to find out what these people said in the past.
     
  16. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    At least the media has finally going after the real bad stuff.
    not just ignoring the the blaze to go after the smoke.

    Or is it because they think it's more salacious and can make a buck at it. :rolleyes:
     
  17. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Well, we can say The Media really screwed the pooch in this election.
    I wonder what they think when they look in the mirror??

    In the meantime, we have another dynamic or paradigm shift that's gone on.
    Or even back to old school...yellow journalism
    If it bleeds, it leads

    From Snopes, is that credible enough these days??

    We Have a Bad News Problem, Not a Fake News Problem

    *** strange...it took my old post, merged it with my new and kicked it up to the top...sorry for the dup :confused:
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2016
    • Like Like x 2
  18. Charlatan

    Charlatan sous les pavés, la plage Donor

    Location:
    Temasek
    One solution (or step in the right direction): We need to recognize which news outlets are "good" and support them with our money.

    Find good journalism and support it. Pay for a subscription.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Exactly @Charlatan ...and there needs to some personal responsibility from those in the media.

    This is in this thread...because it's more about the media than the man.

    The New Rules for Covering Trump

    And on that note, I want to refute this author's premise...
    He's delusional if he thinks the media is going to know how to cover Trump...they still haven't figured it out.

    1. Don't say you can't blame yourselves...yes, you can...look in the mirror. You feed the troll daily. Have done it in the past. Gave millions of free advertisement, ignored others.
    2. Still can't make anything stick...because he doesn't CARE. Figure it out, his reality, isn't yours.
    3. Yes, fact check everything...what do you think we read the friggin' news for?? Entertainment?? (We have HBO and Netflix for that.)

    See this is the head in the sand attitude...that leads up to situations like Nixon...until you get an abuse AND a journalistic investigation that leads to Nixon.
    There has to be a lull to allow the fungus to grow...before you pull up the rock to discover fungus. (who would have thought???)
    Right now, you're letting him play you.
    Suckers.
    Just going through the paces, not blaming yourself.
    "Someone else's job"

    Guess what, dude...it IS your job.
    How would you feel if your doctor said what you did, when you're sick??
    Or your computer "guru" said, "that just the way it is" when your system is fucking up??
    Or your child's teacher said, it's not our fault your kid doesn't know anything and keeps getting bullied at school??

    You ARE paid to find things out.
    That's what NEWS is.
    TRUTH...not bullshit, because we can get fiction elsewhere.

    We expect you to peg Trump....just like we'd expect you to peg Clinton or Obama or ANYONE.
    If you just put up pro things....then you just play into their hands.

    The problem is THIS...you still treat Trump as an entertainer.
    NOT as a politician.
    No politician would get away with the same...neither GOP, Dem or otherwise...and the primaries showed this.

    Clinton was treated like a politician by you...so she died like a politician would. (taken down by friggin emails and a Weiner)
    Trump is still a reality show entertainer in your eyes...a tabloid artist like Kim K. ...and you treat him as such. Like paparazzi.
    BUT in reality, in truth..
    HE HAS POWER NOW!!

    So stop trying to soothe yourself...and COVER him, INVESTIGATE him, ANALYZE him
    Like you would do ANY OTHER damned politician.

    Cause, right now...he's playing you like Yo-Yo Ma plays the violin.
    And you're letting another fungus grow.
    So don't be all shocked when something bad happens.

    OR people confuse you for entertainment...and stop believing you.
    Right now, you're just "collecting a paycheck" until there is nothing existing to get paid from.
    This is how companies go under.
    And how industries die...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Chris Noyb

    Chris Noyb Get in, buckle up, hang on, & don't criticize.

    Location:
    Large City, TX
    For decades politicians, POTUS in particular, and/or their "people" have controlled journalist with a policy of If you don't play by our rules, we won't invite you to the game. IMO this is why journalists never demand a straight answer when politicians dance around instead of actually answering tough questions. It's a game. The journalists are "allowed" to ask tough questions (to keep up appearances?), but aren't allowed to pursue a truthful answer.

    I can see Trump & his staff making sure that any journalist with the nerve to seriously question him won't get a second opportunity to do so.
     
    • Like Like x 2