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Politics The Donkey in the room...the Democrats today

Discussion in 'Tilted Philosophy, Politics, and Economics' started by ASU2003, Mar 1, 2015.

  1. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Well, it looks like there is a momentum going on pushing for it...at least on the Dems side.
    'Power grab' or expanding democracy? Candidates back Election Day holiday
     
  2. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    One of the big issues with the primary process is how much attention the media gives to the candidates who win in Iowa or New Hampshire. Yes, the bigger states are harder to campaign in, an it requires more money, but the process should represent the Democratic base better. Too many people are fleeing the typical early voting states for California, Chicago, and New York.

    We Re-Ordered The Entire Democratic Primary Calendar To Better Represent The Party’s Voters
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    The Dems will keep losing these games as long as they keep playing softball.

    The GOP is playing rollerball

    The need to stop being subtle and playing "fair"
    The other side is playing for keeps.

    Is it ethical?
    No
    But neither is any war.

    You can't go by tradition, precedent and rules...if the other side isn't doing that.
    At least, if you don't want to lose.

    The American public has no memory any more.
    They only know their most recent annoyances and pains.

    You're not going to get any points overall for being noble.
    Because they're not going to remember your nobility.

    Obama found this out the hard way even when he won.
    The GOP harassed him constantly, blocking everything they could.

    These days, many only care about "sides" not what's best for the nation and it's citizens.

    Now they believe their side has to win and has the best notion for whomever they represent...win at any cost.
    The Dems believe they "could" win, if they don't...oh well, they'll win later...and they have "some" ideas that are good...win sometimes. (or at least, that's how it seems...IMHO)

    Anyways...let's see how this plays out.
    Right now, the only reason the GOP truly loses overall these days is when they do something stupid or allow something stupid.

    Now, if your tactic is to wait until the other team trips over themselves.
    That's just pathetic.

    I'm not the only one saying this...liberal or conservative or any point-inbetween. :rolleyes:
     
  4. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    I'd say the young (or younger) progressives have stopped being willing to play nice and are playing hardball.
    AOC goes head on with them and takes no prisoners.
    I think that more of the new generation are taking a cue from her and doing the same.

    They aren't willing to play the game and behave.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Lindy

    Lindy Moderator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Nebraska
    Politics = The art of the possible.
     
  6. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    The Devil's Dictionary - Ambrose Bierce
    Politics
    n. A strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. The conduct of public affairs for private advantage.
     
  7. Remixer

    Remixer Middle Eastern Doofus Donor

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    Listened to this podcast today, and very much agree with what's been said from 1:00:00 until 1:16:00 (and also most stuff until 1:45;00 or so):



    I sincerely hope the Democrats pick up on the changes they need to make in a truly representative candidate selection and the narrative they establish, especially with how the connection of Obama's team in the Jussie Smollett case is making the rounds in Conservative circles in similar ways as the Debbie Wasserman Schultz fiasco did within Bernie supporters; this one completely delegitimizing the political LGBT movement.

    But having witnessed the party's arrogance during as well as after the 2016 election, I heavily doubt the necessary shift will happen in time. I fear they'll successfully manage to self-combust again, and am fully expecting Trump to win a 2nd term.
     
  8. Lindy

    Lindy Moderator Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Nebraska
    There are a lot of things that desperately need attention in the United States. The .6% that identify as trans (that's 6 out of every thousand) are not on most people's list.
     
  9. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    I know that most people don't ever come in contact with trans people but I work with them often.
    They come to DVR most often because they suffer from things like PTSD from being attacked and beaten up over the years of their transition.

    To say that their lives are no worth attention, not something that the Democrats should consider important because there are so few of them, just hurts my heart.
     
  10. Remixer

    Remixer Middle Eastern Doofus Donor

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    No, the point isn't that those issues are not important or legitimate (the contrary actually) - but they were talking about how gender & identity politics being the center of gravity of the Democrat agenda will only serve to work against it, and I agree.
     
  11. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North

    All politics are identity politics.
    It's just up until now, the identity has been white cis christian and mostly male.

    It only seems like trans rights are the 'center' of the Democrat agenda because they are willing to mention it at all.
    As soon as that happens the shit it the fan, every nut job in the world jumps in with both feet.
    It might work against them but at one time 'common knowledge' said that marriage equality was a loser too.
     
  12. Remixer

    Remixer Middle Eastern Doofus Donor

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    I'm sorry, but your two most recent responses are exactly indicative of the the echo chamber mentality being mentioned that is crippling the Democrat political base.

    Identity politics is not what is meant with "I identify with e.g. environmental policies" (if that's what you're getting at), but rather the social and gender identity items.

    And certainly if anyone's primary agenda would revolve around marriage equality first and foremost over items such as environment, economy, security, and foreign policy - then I'd call them a silly motherfucker too.

    This equating of lower prioritization of social/gender issues as complete dismissal of them (and the reactionary nature of how you reason your view) is a mentality that I personally find cancerous within the Democrat mindset, which is why virtue signalling and outrage culture is so prevalent there. You see it in this board prominently as well but everyone seems willfully ignorant of this, which to me then just further indicates that US Democrats still have this mental disconnect and haven't learned a damn thing from the previous election.

    It will be very interesting to see how things go next year.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2019
  13. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    What I am saying is that by not saying anything you are establishing an identity as well - the cis white male identity that has been the standard for so long.
    Just by speaking up in the slightest, making it one plank in your platform, somehow people decide it is all you care about.

    I contain multitudes. I can care about a lot of things.
    The Green New Deal just got shot down by the centrists who only care about their campaign donations.
    I would consider that to be more of a problem then trans rights.
     
  14. redux

    redux Very Tilted Donor

    Location:
    Foggy Bottom
    What drove the Democratic base in last year's mid-term elections was health care (#1 issue according to exit polls), fair immigration reform and economic issues. That, along with a strong anti-Trump sentiment resulted in flipping 40 seats in the House, with 8+ million more votes nationwide in House elections than for Republicans.

    And those are the issues the Democrats in the House have made priorities this year.

    A bill to fix and improve the ACA was introduced last week, after Trump joined a legal challenge to the constitutionality of the law. After eight years, Republicans have no alternative and keep gutting the ACA more and more despite the fact that the ACA is more popular now than ever and will be a top issue in 2020.

    On economic issues, a bill for "pay equity" for women passed the House last week and will be one of those issues that particularly appeals to suburban working women as more voters are finding out first hand that the Trump/Republican tax reform primarily benefited the top one percent far more than working families.

    Like most elections, 2020 will be about these core issues and the policies, programs and actions of the incumbent (Trump).
     
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  15. redux

    redux Very Tilted Donor

    Location:
    Foggy Bottom
    The House passed the net neutrality bill, Save the Internet Act, this morning.
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2019/roll167.xml

    The bill would restore the net neutrality regulations implemented by Obama in 2015 that were later rolled back by Trump. The three core issues and protections for consumers — no blocked content, no throttled access speeds and no prioritization for customers willing to pay more.

    Passage in the Senate is highly unlikely (McConnell already said it is dead on arrival) despite the fact that it passed in the Senate last year (but failed in the Republican House).

    There is widespread support for net neutrality legislation....

    4 in 5 Americans say they support net neutrality: poll

    This will be an issue in 2020 Congressional elections; maybe not a top issue, but particularly of interest to younger voters (18-29 yr olds).
     
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  16. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
  17. redravin

    redravin Cynical Optimist Donor

    Location:
    North
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. ASU2003

    ASU2003 Very Tilted

    Location:
    Where ever I roam
    But it is still the conservative tactic of taking out anyone who dares to become the leader of the left.

    President Trump's 2020 Campaign Gets a Head Start on Facebook

    When Trump's reelection campaign has already spent more money on Facebook to try and persuade people than ALL of the Democratic candidates combined it is a problem.

    I mean, we know that it will get nasty on-line in the next few months, but I want to know that the DNC and the campaigns have learned how to use trolls, bots, and activists to flood the zone and change the conversation on-line.
     
  19. rogue49

    rogue49 Tech Kung Fu Artist Staff Member Donor

    Location:
    Baltimore/DC
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019 at 3:22 AM
    • Agree Agree x 1